What do you miss most about Paramount

[The Interpreter]

Look at the Diamondback queue. Look at the plasma tv's. And ponder.

Terpy, who has said enough, for now

[HTCO]

What do I miss about Paramount? Nothing.

[fbama73]

Yes, Cedarfair is neglecting KI so much they gave it a horrible ride called Diamondback.

I never said they were neglecting it- I said it would never get the attention it deserves. It will never be at the leading edge with records and firsts as long as it is owned by Cedar Fair.

Cedar Fair has already made great improvements in KI, even if they had NOT built Diamondback.

They won't neglect it, but it won't be doing anything before Cedar Point does, and it won't be taking any more records from Cedar Point

[The Interpreter]

I suspect you are wrong on nearly every count in that post. Here are several reasons:

* In the near term, due to crushing debt loads, coaster size, speed, etc. records are far from even a somewhat concern at Cedar Fair. Reliability and safety and popularity and cost all matter and matter a lot. Records, not so much, if at all.

* Cedar Fair is a business, in business to make and maximize profits. If it makes financial sense to put more and better in Kings Island than Cedar Point, so shall it be, if they do things right. They are trying. What has Cedar Fair put at Kings Island since the acquisition? What has it done at Cedar Point?

* The day will come when the head of Cedar Fair does not live in the parking lot at Cedar Point. Nothing is sacred when the company's very existence is at stake. One of the namesake parks is currently for sale. One of the very first parks the company bought as it began expansion, and yet another is also for sale.

You put far too much importance on coaster records. You will, as you go on, be disappointed if you truly believe that Cedar Fair has a primary goal saving the best for Cedar Point. It does not.

[Jasper]

Funny, yesterday when I was walking through Action Zone me and my aunt started to talk about how the park has changes so much since the Paramount years. It seemed like it was a park that was a treat to attend, don't get me wrong it still is but I guess it was because I was younger. I miss the rides being Drop Zone, Face/Off, Top Gun, Italian Job:Stunt Track, and sadly the most themed ride in park history even had to change Tomb Raider:The Ride. The Jeff Siebert ride promos were hilarious. But as much as I complain Paramount will never be back and neither will that atmosphere. All we can do is reminisce on what was and what will never be again. One memory is riding The Beast when the dew was still on the restraints and getting stopped on the second hill due to the capacity not being high enough to fill the 3rd train. Oh and riding the rides in the rain was a complete blast, now, they're closed.

[PREMiERdrum]

Funny, yesterday when I was walking through Action Zone me and my aunt started to talk about how the park has changes so much since the Paramount years. It seemed like it was a park that was a treat to attend, don't get me wrong it still is but I guess it was because I was younger. I miss the rides being Drop Zone, Face/Off, Top Gun, Italian Job:Stunt Track, and sadly the most themed ride in park history even had to change Tomb Raider:The Ride. The Jeff Siebert ride promos were hilarious. But as much as I complain Paramount will never be back and neither will that atmosphere. All we can do is reminisce on what was and what will never be again. One memory is riding The Beast when the dew was still on the restraints and getting stopped on the second hill due to the capacity not being high enough to fill the 3rd train. Oh and riding the rides in the rain was a complete blast, now, they're closed.

While Paramount did do a decent job themeing individual attractions... they botched the themed areas of the park. As you were walking through Action Zone did you remember the old Wild Animal Habitat / Adventure Village area? That was a cohesive, well themed, and beautiful area of the park, that now is little more than a slab of concrete and a splash of primary colors. What about the old Le Taxis area where BLSC now sits?

Maybe it's me being a little older, but I will always remember Paramount as sucking the charm out of the park, and forcing their movies down my throat. I do see a glimmer of hope in Rivertown's revitalization this year. I am fine with minimally and moderately themed attractions so long as they are cohesive with the area of the park that they're in.

[HandsUp]

While Paramount did do a decent job themeing individual attractions... they botched the themed areas of the park. As you were walking through Action Zone did you remember the old Wild Animal Habitat / Adventure Village area? That was a cohesive, well themed, and beautiful area of the park, that now is little more than a slab of concrete and a splash of primary colors. What about the old Le Taxis area where BLSC now sits?

Maybe it's me being a little older, but I will always remember Paramount as sucking the charm out of the park, and forcing their movies down my throat. I do see a glimmer of hope in Rivertown's revitalization this year. I am fine with minimally and moderately themed attractions so long as they are cohesive with the area of the park that they're in.

Agreed. I think alot of it has to do with the KI you 'grew up with'. Mine was Hanna-Barbera, Icees in The Beast line, Antique cars, etc. Paramount did away with much of that-and so I feel a personal resentment towards those years. The KI of today is much more of what I remember as a kid.

+1 on the Action Zone. While the rides are good, that area lacks all personality (and shade!). IMO, themed rides are fine, but it is more important to have good theming in the areas overall--when you're not riding is when you can appreciate the atmosphere.

[specialk141]

i miss the changing colors of the sky-flyer arch. this to me added a great deal of beauty to the parks skyline at night. its something i wish would return.

[The Interpreter]

...Agreed. I think alot of it has to do with the KI you 'grew up with'. Mine was Hanna-Barbera, Icees in The Beast line, Antique cars, etc. Paramount did away with much of that-and so I feel a personal resentment towards those years. The KI of today is much more of what I remember as a kid....

And what of those of us who grew up with no park just north of Cincinnati on I-71, and in fact were at first very resentful that Taft would close Coney Island of Ohio?

[Fat-G]

the music, the movie feel to the park, Tomb Raider, the special effects that made the Italin Job, all the movie names, a diffrent movie in the action theater once in a while, the paramount story, the mystery/funny Outer Limts theme to FOF now its just funny-no-theme, when Face/Offs paint was not faded, the music again, Hanna Barbarra theme, no trims, lower prices, THEMEING, park amostphere(sp). all of it

[LongliveKingsCobra]

I think the HB Theme was under the owners before Paramount Correct? They changed it to NU.

I for one miss the music, and the special feel it gave you when you heard the music themes in the ques. I miss the themeing And I miss Paramount story, it was a tradition to walk through there at least once a visit.

[Oldiesmann]

The entire kids' area was known as HB until 2001, when an expansion took place. The new section was known as Nick Central, and included a re-themed log flume, Reptar, and a few other things. After the 2005 season, HB and Nick Central were combined into Nick Universe and all HB themeing was changed to Nick.

[Tomkatt7]

Don't know if this is a CF thing or not, but I miss the campground.

I loved rolling in on a Sunday afternoon, watching everyone else packing up to leave as we were getting settled in. Riding the tram right to the front gate, and enjoying the park. The campground had a way of making us feel like "VIP"s. I miss that more than anything.

[BoddaH1994]

A lot of the resentment, for lack of a better term, is misplaced...

Don't know if this is a CF thing or not, but I miss the campground.

I loved rolling in on a Sunday afternoon, watching everyone else packing up to leave as we were getting settled in. Riding the tram right to the front gate, and enjoying the park. The campground had a way of making us feel like "VIP"s. I miss that more than anything.

That was Paramount who swapped the camp ground in exchange for a 15% stake in the GWL at Kings Island. When Cedar Fair acquired the Paramount chain, they did not purchase that stake, however Great Wolf bought it back from CBS about a year later.

The entire kids' area was known as HB until 2001, when an expansion took place. The new section was known as Nick Central, and included a re-themed log flume, Reptar, and a few other things. After the 2005 season, HB and Nick Central were combined into Nick Universe and all HB themeing was changed to Nick.

Incorrect. In 1995 Kings Island added Nickelodeom Spat City, which was part of a duel kiddy area along with HBL. In 2001 there was an expansion which included the renovations you mentioned above. It wasn't until 2006 when Kings Island debuted Nickelodeon Universe that HBL was no more. Check out the KICentral History Section for a full time line of park expansions from 1972 on.

the music, the movie feel to the park, Tomb Raider, the special effects that made the Italin Job, all the movie names, a diffrent movie in the action theater once in a while, the paramount story, the mystery/funny Outer Limts theme to FOF now its just funny-no-theme, when Face/Offs paint was not faded, the music again, Hanna Barbarra theme, no trims, lower prices, THEMEING, park amostphere(sp). all of it unsure.gif

You're listing off a bunch of things that were great for the first few weeks, but quickly fell apart - as most new attractions and themes that Paramount built did. The Italian Job operated at 100% for a matter of days before the inboard audio, water effects, etc stopped working and were never replaced. You could make a similar argument with Tomb Raider, although its demise was a bit slower. The "Outer Limits" part of Outer Limits: Flight of Fear disappeared in the late 90s (I think) when Viacom sold the rights to the show Outer Limits to Scifi.

All of your nostalgic memories are inarguable, but they were not how you remembered them... long before Cedar Fair stepped in.

But as much as I complain Paramount will never be back and neither will that atmosphere. All we can do is reminisce on what was and what will never be again.

I think you're remembering something better than it actually was. Paramount ran a good program at first, but quickly cut budgets ridiculously toward the end. I think someone else put it best in saying that the Hollywood theme was just kind of shoved down your throat. It was the look and feel of a traditional theme park with meaningless movie relics just hanging around. What was the point?

Closing thoughts:

If you look at the past three years, where the park was and where it is now, it is absolutely incredible. Cedar Fair has added thrilling new attractions, tons of world class shows, new eateries, and cleaned up the place. If the only thing that we can all agree upon that we miss about Paramount is the piped in music then we are one VERY fortunate group of enthusiasts.

[The Interpreter]

Since many will use this site in future years to look at history, Viacom (not Paramount or CBS) actually held a 15.9 percent interest in the joint venture with Great Wolf at Mason. That interest was not a part of the Cedar Fair acquisition of Paramount Parks, though the resort remained the official resort of what was then Paramount's Kings Island. In June 2007, Great Wolf acquired that interest, paying $6.9 million to Viacom for it.

[standbyme]

Ryan,

After reading the "negatives" of Paramount...would you be up for sharing about 3 things that YOU personally think that they did better than CF...or are there any in your opinion?

Just curious...really.

[KIBeast]

Ryan, couldn't have said it better myself. The Paramount years were horrendous in my opinion. Some of the movies chosen were ok, but a lot of them were flops. Drop Zone...not a great movie and I don't know anyone who actually went to the theatre to watch it. Italian Job movie was mediocre at best. I liked the movie Face/Off and thought it appropriate to name that particular coaster after, however, I've heard many groans about that movie as well. Tomb Raider was probably the best movie overall that Paramount could have used, but as Ryan stated, the theming died a slow death.

It also annoyed me to come to the boards and nearly every Paramount movie was released, people thought there should be a ride themed to their piece of crap excuses for movies.

[LongLiveTheSmurfRide]

I miss how when Paramount owned the park, people had threads where they discussed what they missed about pre-Paramount KI.

[brick52]

Tomb Raider

[KIfan1980]

I miss how when Paramount owned the park, people had threads where they discussed what they missed about pre-Paramount KI.

Totally true - my "nostalgic" memories about how much better the park was come from the 1980's and I resented when Paramount came to MY favorite park and made me look at movie advertising everywhere (even on ride names) AND they had the audacity to change the name to PKI.

Were some things better than before and/or now - I'm sure they were/are. Its all dependent upon ones own perspective I guess.

[BoddaH1994]

Ryan,

After reading the "negatives" of Paramount...would you be up for sharing about 3 things that YOU personally think that they did better than CF...or are there any in your opinion?

Just curious...really.

Absolutely...

1 - I would agree on the music. I have to admit that over all I like the classic rock that Cedar Fair plays, but I thought the classical music and movie themes that Paramount played near the front gate was incredibly appropriate. Same could be said about the soundtrack to the fireworks.

2 - I miss Paramount's saucy attempt to make Action Zone the "backlot" section of the park. From what I've heard through the grapevine, they were originally going to make it have a full movie studio backlot theme but never went through with it. I really do believe in themeing. Kinzel said that the roar of a rollercoaster is themeing in itself, but I don't buy that. Walt Disney probably rolled over in his cryogenic chamber when he heard that. Do you think Disneyland would be what it is today if it were just a collection of rides? Would there even be a Disney World? What would the city of Orlando be like if Walt had taken that route?

3 - I think that Paramount was much better in announcing events and expansions in a spectacular way. Many of you were there to attend the Wintefest press announcement in the Paramount Theatre (Now Kings Island Theatre). Jeff and Maureen showed up dressed up in costume and they announced it in the form of a Christmas tale. It even snowed in the theatre that hot July day!

[standbyme]

Ryan,

I sincerely thank you for taking me up on my request...I was curious, and I like your response.

Thanks again,

J.D.

[CedarPointer]

Look at the Diamondback queue. Look at the plasma tv's. And ponder.

Terpy, who has said enough, for now

http://panteltv.com/outdoorproducts.html

I doubt CF would want to plaster those everywhere, they cost a considerable amount of nickels.

[The Interpreter]

Ah, but were they to generate even more nickels...

Terpy, who could say something about a Jumbotron, a Johnny Rockets and a great adventure, but won't....yet.

[CedarPointer]

Hmm... I happen to remember QTV at Canada's Wonderland being all ads... hmm.

[DropZone99]

I miss so much about Paramount. I miss entering the park and hearing the 'Adventure Music.' And International Street felt like it was actually International. When you entered Paramount Action Zone, there was a whole new atmosphere. You would feel like you were in a studio. I miss waiting inline for Top Gun and hearing Highway to The Danger Zone, and seeing the Premier Trains on Son of Beast. And When King Cobra was still around, I never got to ride it, but I remember seeing it and waiting inline for it. Drop Zone Stunt Tower had announcements Saying your doing a stunt for the Tower Scene, and it really felt like you were!

I miss When all the effects on AE were on and it was like you were actually exploring in the jungle. Coney Mall had a whole different atmosphere, Racer ran Backwards and Forwards, I miss smelling the Gasoline and hearing the engines on Antique Cars. Even though Flight of Fear kind of ruined some of the atmosphere in Coney Mall, It was cool seeing the tall fences with red lights on them (they worked) and the area looked like it was an army base with Flight Team back there too. Vortex dominated the area and fit in good with the area. The pathway in between Coney and Rivertown seemed much more shaded. Flying Eagles was the only ride on that path and It would just soar over the path. Rivertown was alot different, Swan Lake was peaceful and calm, and the only noise were the screams on Vortex and Antique Cars Engines. Beast Canyon was awesome, It's like you were in the farthest point of Rivertown and you were about to invade Beast's territory. The only other thing in the area was Kenton Cove, and I can't remember too much about it but I know I rode it a few times. The part of Rivertown where Diamondback now is, was alot different. You were still in Rivertown, not Nickelodeon Universe. Kings Mills Log Flume blended in with the surroundings so much, it was a whole different ride back then.

Hanna-Barbera Land had a nostalgic feel to it. Even though I didn't watch much of the Hanna Barbera shows, I knew what they were and liked seeing the characters. Beastie seemed as Big as Beast with that name, and even though it wasn't a Cartoon It was great for the area. Phantom Theater was scary to me, but I still rode it a few times.

Overall I miss the Paramount Days so much, Don't get me wrong I like Cedar Fair, but I grew up with Paramount and I'm honestly still not used to it being a CF park, I still call the rides by there old names, and still like to think of the park being Paramount's Kings Island.

[LongLiveTheSmurfRide]

When you entered Paramount Action Zone, there was a whole new atmosphere. You would feel like you were in a studio.

Really? I thought I was in a parking lot, not a studio lot. And don't forget, Paramount took out the gasoline smelling Antique Cars and let a lot of the great theming you're talking about go to waste. All this before our beloved CF took over.

[faeriewench]

The music on International street.

[jzarley]

I think the best theming at KI was the original theming...when international music was played on International Street...Oktoberfest was actually meant to represent Germany...and the owners of the park realized that Rivertown was based on a very young Cincinnati--not the wild west. The park was divided into discernable "lands", and each one really did look & feel different than the next.

Paramount's (Viacom/CBS) theming was pretty much reduced to plopping in a movie themed ride into a "land" of the park where it didn't really belong. Some of the theming was pretty good (for as long as it took for it to break down), particularly in the early days of TG, FoF and TR:TR. However, as someone here said earlier, it always felt "forced."

I agree that the Paramount/Viacom/CBS organization was great at announcing rides--they just could never deliver what they promised. Year after year we heard about the new "incredible, fantastic, most Hollywood-ized attraction in the world!!!!", only to end up with something that barely resembled the press release. Remember the "incredible, lush tropical vegetation" that would spread across CDBB? (I was picturing Typhoon Lagoon...we basically ended up with a bigger, repainted Waterworks...) Or, the incredible "Hollywood-ized" special effects of TR:TR or IJST? In both cases the announcement painted a picture that reality couldn't quite match. Eventually, it just sort of became a joke.

Of course, the attractions were new & novel, and probably fitting the economic realities of a seasonal park...afterall, you can't expect Universal-quality rides for a park that doesn't bring in nearly as many people. So, maybe it was just the unavoidable realities of evolving budgets...or maybe it was an overreaching publicity staff (guess I'd need to pay more attention to Schlitterbahn these days to form a solid opinion on that...)

CF certainly doesn't hype their new attractions beyond what they really are...of course, when there's no real "story" or theme to go along with it, the ride specs are really all you have. (Not that they're not great rides...) Anyone who expects good theming out of a CF park has most likely never been to one, but hey, they've never claimed to be a theme park chain. (But, would it be too much to ask not to hear rock music throughout the entire park? Couldn't there be at least a *little* homage to the original themes? It's almost like they're trying to make it clash as much as possible...) Of course, the real crime is what CF did to KBF...that afterall was a real THEME park...

Like a lot of other people here, good theming is important to my overall enjoyment of a park. That's why (with the exception of CP) my top five favorite parks are either Universal or Disney. Those people know how to develop, build, and MAINTAIN a themed environment. (Busch does a pretty darn good job of that as well...)

Ironically, the time period that I consider the darkest days of KI (during Carl Lindner's ownership) actually delivered two of the best themed rides--Phantom Theater and Adventure Express--of the park's entire history. Granted, the technology was less complex, but AE is in better shape today after nearly 20 years than either TR:TR or IJST (sorry, I still can't yet remember CF's generic re-names for them...which should probably say something right there!)

[CedarPointer]

I want the Action Zone sign back. There was no reason to remove it.