Coronavirus Impacting Theme Parks

[CheetahDrew]

24 minutes ago, PilotDude said:

"the ruling affirms that facilities must follow Ohio Department of Health safety protocols to keep patrons and all Ohioans safe and healthy. These facilities were due to open Tuesday anyways. However, our office disagrees with the ruling’s analysis of law.” 

 

All Dewine would have to do is say we well the rules say no more then X people in a given area, and neither park has provided a plan on how to comply with that.  A great example of this is the fact Cedar Fair plans to use traditional que lines, the state would be able to argue that mass groups of people put into a small space can't be done in complacence with the rules. That is also a single case in the state where multiple other cases have been ruled against the business case in point, Gilded Social v. Amy Acton where a bridal shop was ruled against.  When we consider case law we can not look sideways but must look upwards, what did the appellate court rule, what about the supreme court what have they said?

 

I want the park to open just as much as everyone else, and do believe it can be done safe as is evident with other parks like Disney Shanghai opening. But this route was a poor choice for the park as the general thought is the parks were due to be announced in the next few days, most suspecting Friday the 5th anyways. I do not blame the park for this lawsuit either, they are under incredible pressure from the Warren County Commissioners that has been asking them to sue since the March.  The park is currently a pawn in a political game, a very unenviable position to be in.

"Chief U.S. District Judge Algenon L. Marbley said that Gilded Social: The Fancy Occasion shop had not been singled out by not being offered a way to contest being ruled nonessential immediately. Marbley said the state has a legitimate justification for its business restrictions." - 

You are correct in the fact that the ruling in Gilded Social v. Amy Acton was not successful however, this was from months ago when the situation was not the same as it is today and virtually everything was shut down hence the reasoning for the Chief Judges comments stating they had "not been singled out". In this particular case however, we see many things if not just about everything but Amusement Parks and Casinos re opening, the Legal Precedent being established here and what is cited in the lawsuit is Rock House Fitness v. Acton, which was successful with Judge Eugene Lucci stating Dr Amy Acton acted "in an impermissibly arbitrary, unreasonable, and oppressive manner and without any procedural safeguards.” The Issue for the court now that Legal Precedent has been found is determining whether that also applies to this case, which I and many others believe it does. because in this situation they are being excluded unlike what Chief Judge Marbley was stating. 

As to your comment in reference to traditional queue lines, I read the filing with Warren County Common Pleas Court and there is no mention of traditional queues being an issue, perhaps you found this information from somewhere else or are assuming that this is the case but I have not heard of this from anywhere. As far as it being a good move, I believe it was a very good move on the part of the park because they have legal rights just as everyone else does and this will likely be decided or settled very quickly. 

[IceePirate]

2 hours ago, Rifleman said:

The problem is that for the short term, anyone on unemployment is making WAY more than they would working at KI. Until the extra $600 a week phases out, it will be very difficult for businesses to fill any positions below $25/Hour.

That's true. I'm pretty sure I'm getting laid off in about a month or so, so I'd qualify for the full amount of unemployment + the $600. Which is a bit over $1,000 a week in Ohio. I actually just accepted a job as a ride op in the past few days. The way unemployment works is any income you make while receiving unemployment is supposed to reduce your benefits dollar for dollar. So make $250 a week and that benefit reduces to $750, effectively giving you no incentive to work as you'd get paid the same sitting at home as you would working. I literally just took the job to have a fun thing to do a couple days a week and learn more about rollercoaster/ride ops. I won't be receiving any economic benefit, but I'll be getting knowledge about how stuff works, plus the handful of sub-par benefits Cedar Fair gives to associates.

There is the side benefit of being less of a burden on the taxpayer, but that's not the real reason I'm doing it. I share this with you all to give some perspective as to why people might not even be looking for jobs right now since the unemployment benefit is immense.

[dbackdreams]

Ughghhhhh I just want Kings Island to open.  They can do it safe!  I want to ride Diamondback the biggest fastest tallest longest meanest metal roller coaster ever to strike Kings Island!!!!!  But I want to ride Orion too it will be the 15th coaster under my belt if im not scared.

[CheetahDrew]

Hoping for good news? 

[IceePirate]

So he is making it up today. Nice, glad I didn't miss out on a day Wining with DeWine!

[teenageninja]

3 minutes ago, IceePirate said:

So he is making it up today. Nice, glad I didn't miss out on a day Wining with DeWine!

What ride are you going to be on, if you don't mind us asking.

[IceePirate]

Just now, teenageninja said:

What ride are you going to be on, if you don't mind us asking.

I'm supposed to be choosing that in the next few days here, waiting on an email from the park

[chibul]

So interesting. I wouldn't think KI would be hiring ride ops if they didn't have an idea of when they'll be able to reopen....and yet the lawsuit says otherwise.

Very strange.

[disco2000]

23 minutes ago, CheetahDrew said:

Hoping for good news? 

I am not finding anywhere proof of a press conference for today?  Not even fox8news cited in this indicates anything on Twitter or their website?  Not even the official Ohio Channel:

 

[teenageninja]

7 minutes ago, chibul said:

So interesting. I wouldn't think KI would be hiring ride ops if they didn't have an idea of when they'll be able to reopen....and yet the lawsuit says otherwise.

Very strange.

Being prepared for when they are allowed to be open.

[FreedomPenguin]

To me, covid is a moot (not trying to cause any fighting, but to me I don't care about it), I am not worried and will go day 1 opening, water park, full on amusement parks, im hoping a mask isn't required as I won't wear one if not, but whatever if it is. 

 

it needs to open!. it is not fair to let other business open but not amusement parks, that's favoring and if did happen, ohio should obligate to pay the entire earnings lost by prohibiting them from opening. I want some blue ice cream and some wave pools and orionnnn

[Kodistict]

It looks like somebody is spraying water in the Db pond right now.

[IceePirate]

1 minute ago, Kodistict said:

It looks like somebody is spraying water in the Db pond right now.

Maintenance car at the train storage shed too, looks like they're getting it ready to test

[THE_BEASTmaster]

Fill it up fill it up so i can ride Diamondback the biggest fastest tallest longest meanest metal roller coaster ever to strike Kings Island!!!!!

Correction: WAS the tallest, fastest, longest, meanest steel coaster. I think Orion wants to have a word with you on that.  

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Kodistict]

9 minutes ago, THE_BEASTmaster said:

Correction: WAS the tallest, fastest, meanest steel coaster. I think Orion wants to have a word with you on that.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Sorry for being off topic, but I can't help but notice the "Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk" in your post, whats Tapatalk?

[dbackdreams]

7 minutes ago, THE_BEASTmaster said:

Correction: WAS the tallest, fastest, longest, meanest steel coaster. I think Orion wants to have a word with you on that.  

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Well yeah but Oroin hasnt struck Kings Island lol  I might like it better if im not scared of it

[THE_BEASTmaster]

Sorry for being off topic, but I can't help but notice the "Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk" in your post, whats Tapatalk?

It’s an app that let’s you connect with forums using your phone. That way you don’t have to go to the actual site.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[PatchesC]

Someone shared on FB

[CheetahDrew]

34 minutes ago, disco2000 said:

I am not finding anywhere proof of a press conference for today?  Not even fox8news cited in this indicates anything on Twitter or their website?  Not even the official Ohio Channel:

 

Just heard on my Local News Station that there is indeed a press conference.

[IndyGuy4KI]

7 minutes ago, Kodistict said:

Sorry for being off topic, but I can't help but notice the "Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk" in your post, whats Tapatalk?

It is an add on we install in the forums for the Tapatalk app that allows you connect to multiple forum sites at once. I find going to the actual site better because you loose some functionality in Tapatalk, but we do offer the option.

[dbackdreams]

I'll try to spell better and now I now about the signature.  I just hope nobody else makes fun of me like atht meanie!!!!!

[LuckyluvsKI]

4 hours ago, flightoffear1996 said:

And that is the problem. The government Incentivizing people not to work. 

lol not really. I can't wait to go back to work and yes I'll be making less than unemployment. But unemployment isn't forever and a good job is, especially one you enjoy. Quit passing on the same rhetoric that those in unemployment right now are lazy. 

[Gabe]

19 hours ago, IceePirate said:

You all might want to give the complaint a read, there's some pretty interesting stuff in there. For one thing, KI is going super hard against the director and Warren County who can supposedly issue their own opening order

Except county and local authorities can only enact more stringent requirements than those issued by the State.  Meanwhile, the counties where Kennywood and Knoebels are located in PA are going to the last phase of reopening today.  Kennywood FWIW showing a 7/1 open date.  

[Gabe]

7 hours ago, PilotDude said:

 

Not great, and IMHO it was a tactical error on the parks part, but the park is being pushed by the Warren County Commissioners so they are between a rock and a hard place.  Every other time someone has sued to reopen in Ohio and federal court, the courts side against the business and they stay closed but now with the added cost of court. The case wont be heard by a judge for 60-90 days, and then wont be ruled on for up to a year. And if at the end of a year if they are still closed, and not just reopened with the lifting of restrictions, now we begin the appeal process which is up to 3-5 years between cases.  The standard on how the courts will treat all of these cases is South Bay United Pentecostal Church v. Gavin Newsom, Governor of California.  This is a very recent supreme court ruling, and yes it is a ruling even thought they never heard arguments which is an extraordinary measure. But the Supreme Court upheld churches being closed, and churches have more autonomy to stay open then a business. Below is a telling paragraph and will be cited everywhere else to throw out these lawsuits.  All of this lawsuit did was make Kings Island a hostile party to the Governor, the park is being used as a pawn by the county commissioners and in the end the park is the one who will get hurt.

 

The precise question of when restrictions on particular social activities should be lifted during the pandemic is a dynamic and fact-intensive matter subject to reasonable disagreement. Our Constitution principally entrusts “[t]he safety and the health of the people” to the politically ac-countable officials of the States “to guard and protect.” Ja-cobson v. Massachusetts, 197 U. S. 11, 38 (1905). When those officials “undertake[] to act in areas fraught with medical and scientific uncertainties,” their latitude “must be especially broad.” Marshall v. United States, 414 U. S. 417, 427 (1974). Where those broad limits are not exceeded, they should not be subject to second-guessing by an “une-lected federal judiciary,” which lacks the background, com-petence, and expertise to assess public health and is not ac-countable to the people. See Garciav. San Antonio Metropolitan Transit Authority, 469 U. S. 528, 545 (1985).

 

 

EDIT: 

So I have now had a chance to read the court filling in its entirety and it is not great.  If my lawyer filled this in court, I would be embarrassed with all of the cutting and pasting errors and obvious revision where things were removed but the grammar wasn't updated to reflect that.  "that  latitude  remains  subject  to  limitations imposed by both the Ohio Constitution", both what? In other parts they politicize the topic while in others they make claims that are illogical and go against existing law. "The Ohio Department of Health, its Director, and county health departments claim the authority to criminalize and fine operation of safe amusement and water parks." Yeah they do that every single day across the state and country, i.e. food safety laws.  This is blatantly nonfactual as they have set up a public board to review business objections to not being allowed to open, and other courts have upheld them as constitutional already, "without providing any process, venue, or judicial review to determine whether these Ohioans’ businesses are in fact safe enough to warrant operation". "This harm may only be remedied by a ruling from this Court, and Defendants must be immediately and permanently enjoined from imposing criminal, civil, or equitable sanctions on the safe operation of Ohio amusement and water parks including Plaintiffs."  This is not the only way they can be freed of a perceived harm, they could use the review boards already in place that the courts already view as acceptable, and courts typically look down on plaintiffs that could have received relief elsewhere and didn't attempt that route first. 

 

Long story short the lawsuit doesn't look like it will be ruled on in Cedar Fairs favor, but IMHO this wont even go to trial purely due to the speed of our court systems. Reading elsewhere on what Cedar Fair plans to do to reopen, they are lacking in a few key areas compared to other parks that have been allowed to open.  The biggest example is Cedar Fair believes they can safely social distance in a traditional que line whereas most every other chain has gone to a digital ride wait system.  My speculation and it is purely speculation is that Dewine wants them to go to a similar system and Cedar Fair up to this point hasn't been willing to or is unable for some other reason and that is the hold up.  Once they get this last sticking point worked out they will reopen with the rest of the parks, and remember only 1 park is operating in the entire country with everyone else due to open in the next week to couple months.  What ever Disney does is going to be the standard everyone else will be held too. They have experience reopening parks in other countries and are a pillar of society that people look up to for guidance.

or, the lawsuit was never designed to force DeWine's hand, but merely to bring him back to the table. Between this and the bill amendment, I'm sure the Governor is at least listening again.  In all of this, though, is the silence of Vici/Hard Rock.  That is telling too.

[PatchesC]

Any think he may avoid amusement park questions?

[Snowball]

You can watch live here. He's talking about universities and PPE as of typing this.

[disco2000]

1 minute ago, PatchesC said:

Any think he may avoid amusement park questions?

I don't think he will...the question will be does he take the high road or does he call out CF on why he wouldn't approve their plan...if that is the reason why as rumored.

[chibul]

Not a word about them so far.

[Snowball]

Nothing about amusement parks yet and he just said he's "running out of time", and skipped over the topic of PPE.

[disco2000]

Why should he LOL, he knows the reporters will ask!

Here we go...