2024 Operating Calendar is Posted.

[BoddaH1994]

Just now, Tr0y said:

Well after the comments made by Six Flags CEO that could possibly be a thing in the near future.

He has walked back a lot of what he has said, but hopefully that’s still his plan. He wanted to go from Wal-Mart guests to Target guests. Probably not the best way to put it, but it’s something that needs to be done.

Remember, pre-Disneyland amusement parks were places to be avoided because they were seen as seedy and unclean. Let’s not let that happen again. 

[disco2000]

6 minutes ago, BoddaH1994 said:

Because their business plan is to make the parks radically accessible to everyone. They’ve set that expectation, and it would be a hard, incremental thing to walk back. 

So instead they will continue to devalue the product to make it accessible to everyone and thus drive people away because it is always crowded, dirty, long lines, etc.

Or would they be better to bite the bullet and double the price and lose the low hanging fruit that wasn't spending in the park anyway and provide an overall better product to retain and increase those that will spend in the park.

As long as they wouldn't lose half the pass holders if they doubled the price, they come out ahead (which I doubt they would, especially if they make a commitment that they will not devalue the offering with reduced hours and other still legal "bait and switch" moves that fall under the subject to change...

[Tr0y]

4 minutes ago, BoddaH1994 said:

He has walked back a lot of what he has said, but hopefully that’s still his plan. He wanted to go from Wal-Mart guests to Target guests. Probably not the best way to put it, but it’s something that needs to be done.

Remember, pre-Disneyland amusement parks were places to be avoided because they were seen as seedy and unclean. Let’s not let that happen again. 

Now that I put more thought into it, I believe that’s how Coney Island maintained a dry side because they were cheaper than Kings Island till Kings Island priced them out.
 

I wonder if hypothetically did increase the price of gold passes that we could see a rebirth of Coney island dry side.

[DispatchMaster]

55 minutes ago, BoddaH1994 said:

mindless park sycophants who will applaud the park for offering much less for the same or higher prices.

Pointing out that the parks operate as businesses makes me a sycophant? Methinks you have lost touch with reality. An opinion further supported by your resorting to childish, vulgar insults.

25 minutes ago, disco2000 said:

a destination park cross-threading lol

LOLOLOOOLLOLOLLllOLOLLOLLLLLLOO!!!!!111!1 

[BoddaH1994]

1 hour ago, DispatchMaster said:

Pointing out that the parks operate as businesses makes me a sycophant? Methinks you have lost touch with reality. An opinion further supported by your resorting to childish, vulgar insults.

LOLOLOOOLLOLOLLllOLOLLOLLLLLLOO!!!!!111!1 

No, pointing out that the park is a business does not make you a sycophant; however, when people have reasonable disappointment in getting less for the same price (Winterfest, Haunt, Grand Carnivale) or when people are reasonably upset when the park operated unethically by selling us on one thing and delivering much less (Premier Pass) and you are the first to defend the park with baseless talking points or defense by technicality… that does.

Again, if you want to run your business with the model of, “let’s see what we can get away with” then that’s your prerogative, but in the real world it’s very short-sighted and rarely pays off. If McDonalds sold a double cheeseburger and quietly started only putting on meat patty on them, they could save a few bucks.. until people noticed. Then what would happen?

[disco2000]

1 hour ago, BoddaH1994 said:

..... If McDonalds sold a double cheeseburger and quietly started only putting on meat patty on them, they could save a few bucks.. until people noticed. Then what would happen?

Then they go to Burger King where they can "have it your way" 

And Wendy's would resurrect their "Where's the Beef" campaign 

 

[DonHelbig]

On 11/7/2023 at 1:53 PM, DispatchMaster said:

It’s as adorable as it is predictable.

Hmmm…trying to remember where I’ve seen that phrase before. 

[BoddaH1994]

7 minutes ago, DonHelbig said:

Hmmm…trying to remember where I’ve seen that phrase before. 

[brenthodge]

On 11/7/2023 at 2:34 PM, BoddaH1994 said:

I’ve had the same thoughts. Dollywood charges $200 for a Gold Pass and many would say they offer a product in-kind. I wish KI would do the same. 

And I’d venture that they have raised those pass prices to make them a bit “less attractive “ to the local “very few weeks” attendee that rarely spends much. 

[rlentless]

I've been a Gold Pass buyer for 20+ years and always been happy with the value of my purchase.  But I do feel bad for the people who bought Prestige and felt jilted by the park.  I came close to buying Prestige but decided against and glad I did not purchase it. 

My biggest complaint for the past several years is more open daily dates in August.  Most of the other parks in the chain are open daily in August to Labor Day.

I know students are back in school.  But it still is summertime!!  I want to go over and ride The Beast at lunch time before summer is over.    It is sad to see those close dates in the calendar.

[cdubbs727]

Regarding the Aug. 12 closing date. We usually head down that final week of operations (we're from Detroit) because, traditionally, it's been a slow week with kids back in school. This past year, they originally had the final day of regular operations scheduled for early that week -- I believe it was the 12th or 13th; the Tuesday of that week. So, we made our reservations around that and came down, only to find that between the announcement and our coming down, they changed the hours and were now open the entire week. So it's subject to change; my guess, probably based on staffing. 

[flightoffear1996]

This doesn't affect us much as we typically only visit the park on weekends but man it feels bad that we are paying more for less.  

[super7]

Boy Cedar Fair/6 flags has it all figured out don’t they? Cut cut cut operating hours and days. 
 

But somehow Dollywood can stay open almost daily from March until the end of December.   Maybe because they cater to customers other than Thrillseekers that can attend when school is in session.    They also seem to know how to treat their employees much better than Cedar Fair. I’m not cutting their hours with ghost mystery weather closures.
 

 

[brenthodge]

2 hours ago, super7 said:

Boy Cedar Fair/6 flags has it all figured out don’t they? Cut cut cut operating hours and days. 
 

But somehow Dollywood can stay open almost daily from March until the end of December.   Maybe because they cater to customers other than Thrillseekers that can attend when school is in session.    They also seem to know how to treat their employees much better than Cedar Fair. I’m not cutting their hours with ghost mystery weather closures.
 

 

Dollywood has quite a few closed days and shorter days. They have added days for sure. As you say, the potential revenue makes it worth the cost to them. 

[flightoffear1996]

Maybe just maybe the in this competitive business the park is in they should look in the mirror and figure out why they need to cut these days and do something about it.  Yes it could be outside factors like the economy but there is still ways to make your park thrive and stand out and earn those travel dollars.

[DoomPlague]

This year I went on one of those 8PM-close/midweek days that they cut from next year and was surprised (disappointed) at the crowds. Lines were noticeably longer than previous years for that week.  And they were far from the "why are they even open?" level that I remember back when they had a weekdays operating in late August in the 90s.

[FUN&ONLY!]

On 11/9/2023 at 12:01 PM, cdubbs727 said:

Regarding the Aug. 12 closing date. We usually head down that final week of operations (we're from Detroit) because, traditionally, it's been a slow week with kids back in school. This past year, they originally had the final day of regular operations scheduled for early that week -- I believe it was the 12th or 13th; the Tuesday of that week. So, we made our reservations around that and came down, only to find that between the announcement and our coming down, they changed the hours and were now open the entire week. So it's subject to change; my guess, probably based on staffing. 

The original calendar Kings Island released for last year had that final week in August, but sometime in January or February, the calendar was changed so that those days were removed altogether. With the calendar change, the hours  were also cut leading up to Memorial Day. Eventually, the last few days in August were added back but without Soak City operating hours.

There is a rumor that talks of a possible Six Flags/Cedar Fair merger began in January of this year, which would align with a lot of the cost-cutting we saw this year. In addition to Kings Island slimming its operating calendar around that time, a Peanuts show was rumored to have been cut before Kings Island opened for the season. Additionally, certain rides started the season with slashed operating hours (the water rides and train) compared to previous seasons, and a lot of game locations were also planned to be shuttered for the season.

[jcgoble3]

*peeks in from lurker land*

I didn't renew my pass last fall for this year because I was beginning to lose interest as I was no longer getting the adrenaline rush I used to from coasters (Xtreme Skyflyer was the last remaining true adrenaline rush at KI for me). I was also noticing a gradual decline in quality even back in 2022. It looks like I picked the right time to make my exit and move on to other pursuits and hobbies. I've followed the further decline via Facebook this year, mainly through the passholders group, and based on everything I saw this year, this 2024 schedule doesn't surprise me in the least. Kings Island at this point is a shell of what it was five years ago.

I've taken up whitewater kayaking, and while that might be more expensive, at least I get my adrenaline rushes, don't have to deal with corporate bull****, have far fewer crowds to deal with, and can do it year-round with a drysuit.

I was considering buying a couple of Winterfest tickets this year (Mom loves Winterfest), but the likelihood of that is continuing to go downhill.

[Tr0y]

1 hour ago, jcgoble3 said:

 

I've taken up whitewater kayaking, and while that might be more expensive, at least I get my adrenaline rushes, don't have to deal with corporate bull****, have far fewer crowds to deal with, and can do it year-round with a drysuit.

Did you kayak the Gualey River?

[jcgoble3]

4 hours ago, Tr0y said:

Did you kayak the Gualey River?

I'm not at that skill level yet (the Gauley is solid Class IV and V stuff and I've only just begun to advance to Class III rivers), but the Lower Gauley (Class IV) is one of my goals for next fall. I did do a commercial rafting trip on the Gauley in September (both Upper and Lower) and had a blast doing it.

[Tr0y]

6 hours ago, jcgoble3 said:

I'm not at that skill level yet (the Gauley is solid Class IV and V stuff and I've only just begun to advance to Class III rivers), but the Lower Gauley (Class IV) is one of my goals for next fall. I did do a commercial rafting trip on the Gauley in September (both Upper and Lower) and had a blast doing it.

It’s been a couple years since I’ve rafted the Gauley. The last time I rafted it with my rafting friends we had a bad experience, almost capsized on the first group of rapids. Got stuck on a rock right before shipwreck. (Massive undercut). So I haven’t been able to convince my friends to give it another go. We still make an annual trip to the New River tho. 

[super7]

On 11/10/2023 at 12:09 AM, brenthodge said:

Dollywood has quite a few closed days and shorter days. They have added days for sure. As you say, the potential revenue makes it worth the cost to them. 

https://hfe.widen.net/s/hm2pjhbzhb/24dw_opcal_festivals
 

Dollywood has posted their 2024 schedule. They are operating almost daily except for five day weeks in April and August.   There are only 21 days that they are closed next year between March 8 and New Year’s.  And 3 of those are Thanksgiving/Christmas.
 

Their shortest operating day is nine hours long now  

This is an expansion over the 2023 schedule where they were operating at least five days a week and the shortest day was it eight hours  

it sounds like they’re doing something absolutely right to grow their schedule while these other mismanaged theme parks are cutting their schedules.  They run their business with ethics towards the customers and employees.

 

 

[Tr0y]

4 hours ago, super7 said:

https://hfe.widen.net/s/hm2pjhbzhb/24dw_opcal_festivals
 

Dollywood has posted their 2024 schedule. They are operating almost daily except for five day weeks in April and August.   There are only 21 days that they are closed next year between March 8 and New Year’s.  And 3 of those are Thanksgiving/Christmas.
 

Their shortest operating day is nine hours long now  

This is an expansion over the 2023 schedule where they were operating at least five days a week and the shortest day was it eight hours  

it sounds like they’re doing something absolutely right to grow their schedule while these other mismanaged theme parks are cutting their schedules.  They run their business with ethics towards the customers and employees.

 

 

In fairness their Gold Pass is twice as much as a Gold Pass for Kings Island.

[super7]

1 hour ago, Tr0y said:

In fairness their Gold Pass is twice as much as a Gold Pass for Kings Island.

Dollywood also does not offer a cheap meal plan as well.. In fairness, you get what you pay for.  This is one reason that Kings Island and  Cedar Fair Parks are being run so poorly these days.    

I have said this before. The company has sold these cheap season passes and these cheap meal plans so long that now their low spending customers expect it.    Plus, they came most of their attractions at this low spending market. 
 

So their only solution to make money is to cut cut cut since the revenue is not high enough.   Cutting services and benefits. It’s just leaving to further attendance increases.  It’s a downward spiral that started with their low season pass, and meal plan prices.

I personally would rather pay more and get a better product and treated better.   The cheap season passes is the reason that a Cedar Fair thinks they can pull antics like closing the park early for low attendance.  Their thought process is that the season pass holders are going to renew regardless of how they treated because of the low price 

It’s obviously failing shown by the lower attendance

[DonHelbig]

6 hours ago, super7 said:

https://hfe.widen.net/s/hm2pjhbzhb/24dw_opcal_festivals
 

Dollywood has posted their 2024 schedule. They are operating almost daily except for five day weeks in April and August.   There are only 21 days that they are closed next year between March 8 and New Year’s.  And 3 of those are Thanksgiving/Christmas.
 

Their shortest operating day is nine hours long now  

This is an expansion over the 2023 schedule where they were operating at least five days a week and the shortest day was it eight hours  

it sounds like they’re doing something absolutely right to grow their schedule while these other mismanaged theme parks are cutting their schedules.  They run their business with ethics towards the customers and employees.

 

 

Dollywood added 23 operating days for 2024.

https://themeparksbydon.com/dollywoods-2024-a-year-of-extraordinary-adventures-and-experiences/

[super7]

It's also worth mentioning that Dollywood is operating DAILY Jan 1 to Jan 7 2024 for the end of their Christmas event.

I saw some posts online about how much people thought a CF/SF all park pass should be? They were giving prices like $250, which is only slightly more than a Dollywood, Hershey, etc one park pass.  The customers that CF and SF have decided to cater to with their virtually all-thrill-and-kiddie lineup of attractions is bringing the kind of customer that wants everything for nothing......

I have a 2024 CF  all park pass with meals and drinks that i paid appx $375 for through Canada's Wonderland.  I don't attend these parks as much as i used to, but i will get my money's worth out of it with at least 10 visits.  However, that is ALL that i will spend at a Cedar Fair park in 24 because of the unethical way they do business (namely ghost weather closures for low attendance) and because of their current philosophy to cut cut cut.

I am in driving distance of Dollywood and will probably spend $1,000 plus there next year.   $234 for the gold pass, eating every time i go, even merchandise (i found a great wallet there last visit).  They don't mysteriously close due to low attendance and blame the weather, so i know i will get to do what I am planning when i go there.   I will gladly spend money there because they provide a great product.

Their employees are VERY friendly.   When a park can provide a full working schedule 10 months of the year and treats their employees right (back to the ghost weather closures which cut employee hours), they can retain good employees and enough of them to keep everything open.   I visited in Sept on weekdays and the ONLY thing closed in the ENTIRE park was ONE restaurant ONE day.

It's also wonderful to be able to visit a park on Spring, Fall and Winter weekdays.    I find that Dollywood attracts a diverse crowd that comes for the shows as well as the rides.  On these off season weekdays, half the crowd is there for the shows and there are no lines for the rides.    Quality experience because they are smart enough to appeal to a more varied, higher spending crowd.

They have obviously figured out how to use their facility 10 months of the year while Cedar Fair and these other chains leave them sit empty the majority of the year.  I think CF, SF, and SEAS are very BAD investments right now if one if playing the stock market, because they have NO long term growth plan.  Only milking what they can out of current customers through cost cutting to meet their short term profit goals.

Cedar Fair was initially a great thing for the Taft parks but the wrong people have moved up the ranks and have no idea how to grow a business.  This merge is a desperate last attempt at cost cutting (it will eliminate jobs so it is also pure greed at the expense of the employees).

CF is not a well managed OR ethical business.   

[BoddaH1994]

9 hours ago, super7 said:

It's also worth mentioning that Dollywood is operating DAILY Jan 1 to Jan 7 2024 for the end of their Christmas event.

I saw some posts online about how much people thought a CF/SF all park pass should be? They were giving prices like $250, which is only slightly more than a Dollywood, Hershey, etc one park pass.  The customers that CF and SF have decided to cater to with their virtually all-thrill-and-kiddie lineup of attractions is bringing the kind of customer that wants everything for nothing......

I have a 2024 CF  all park pass with meals and drinks that i paid appx $375 for through Canada's Wonderland.  I don't attend these parks as much as i used to, but i will get my money's worth out of it with at least 10 visits.  However, that is ALL that i will spend at a Cedar Fair park in 24 because of the unethical way they do business (namely ghost weather closures for low attendance) and because of their current philosophy to cut cut cut.

I am in driving distance of Dollywood and will probably spend $1,000 plus there next year.   $234 for the gold pass, eating every time i go, even merchandise (i found a great wallet there last visit).  They don't mysteriously close due to low attendance and blame the weather, so i know i will get to do what I am planning when i go there.   I will gladly spend money there because they provide a great product.

Their employees are VERY friendly.   When a park can provide a full working schedule 10 months of the year and treats their employees right (back to the ghost weather closures which cut employee hours), they can retain good employees and enough of them to keep everything open.   I visited in Sept on weekdays and the ONLY thing closed in the ENTIRE park was ONE restaurant ONE day.

It's also wonderful to be able to visit a park on Spring, Fall and Winter weekdays.    I find that Dollywood attracts a diverse crowd that comes for the shows as well as the rides.  On these off season weekdays, half the crowd is there for the shows and there are no lines for the rides.    Quality experience because they are smart enough to appeal to a more varied, higher spending crowd.

They have obviously figured out how to use their facility 10 months of the year while Cedar Fair and these other chains leave them sit empty the majority of the year.  I think CF, SF, and SEAS are very BAD investments right now if one if playing the stock market, because they have NO long term growth plan.  Only milking what they can out of current customers through cost cutting to meet their short term profit goals.

Cedar Fair was initially a great thing for the Taft parks but the wrong people have moved up the ranks and have no idea how to grow a business.  This merge is a desperate last attempt at cost cutting (it will eliminate jobs so it is also pure greed at the expense of the employees).

CF is not a well managed OR ethical business.   

“Non-transparent” is the word that comes to mind for me.

They stooged off the Prestige Pass thing, and instead of fessing up and apologizing, they kept your money and changed the language on the web site.

They sold a a plurality of season passes and then announced they were no longer year-round at KD and Carowinds.

They implemented a chaperone policy (for right or wrong) and when people had questions about how that would affect them, their SPX ran and hid. 

If a woman steals baby food to feed her starving baby, she’s not unethical, but still a criminal. If you have bad news and withhold it until after peoples’ money is locked in, you’re unethical… and a coward. 
 

You know what would be the perfect solution? Making things like season passes non-committal subscriptions. Budget cuts for Haunt? You can cancel your membership until December. 6:00pm closes during the early season? Cancel your membership and resubscribe in June. That way there would be accountability and would cut the bait-and-switch tactics that they took up.  

 

[disco2000]

^And don't forget on the Prestige Pass, they wouldn't even entertain allowing someone to revert back to gold or platinum when a big chunk of the legal "bait and switch" occurred within weeks of someone buying a pass.  They penalized the early bird.  I bet most would have been happy if they would have even said the "refund" had to be in beagle bucks LOL.

And until a critical mass decides to forego the little savings by renewing early and instead waits until the first day they decide to go to the park the following year, they will continue these tactics.

As long as they continue to have healthy early renewals, they have no incentive to change their practice and will continue to pull the legal "subject to change without notice" card whenever it works for them.  ERT seems like the next logical cut.  Think of the savings.

[BoddaH1994]

43 minutes ago, disco2000 said:

^And don't forget on the Prestige Pass, they wouldn't even entertain allowing someone to revert back to gold or platinum when a big chunk of the legal "bait and switch" occurred within weeks of someone buying a pass.  They penalized the early bird.  I bet most would have been happy if they would have even said the "refund" had to be in beagle bucks LOL.

And until a critical mass decides to forego the little savings by renewing early and instead waits until the first day they decide to go to the park the following year, they will continue these tactics.

As long as they continue to have healthy early renewals, they have no incentive to change their practice and will continue to pull the legal "subject to change without notice" card whenever it works for them.  ERT seems like the next logical cut.  Think of the savings.

Eventually, everyone will be affected by the, "terms subject to change, no refunds" mentality that they have. I agree - most wouldn't notice... until it's the person who primarily goes during the week in the shoulder season, or whose kid really enjoys 'Four Drummers Drumming,' and so on. It seems like everyone and everything is subject to change, which will push back the purchasing decisions People not renewing early puts them at risk of not renewing. They are not positioning themselves well for that. They're playing the short game when the long game is almost always what pays off. 

[Tr0y]

2 hours ago, BoddaH1994 said:

“Non-transparent” is the word that comes to mind for me.

They stooged off the Prestige Pass thing, and instead of fessing up and apologizing, they kept your money and changed the language on the web site.

They sold a a plurality of season passes and then announced they were no longer year-round at KD and Carowinds.

They implemented a chaperone policy (for right or wrong) and when people had questions about how that would affect them, their SPX ran and hid. 

If a woman steals baby food to feed her starving baby, she’s not unethical, but still a criminal. If you have bad news and withhold it until after peoples’ money is locked in, you’re unethical… and a coward. 
 

You know what would be the perfect solution? Making things like season passes non-committal subscriptions. Budget cuts for Haunt? You can cancel your membership until December. 6:00pm closes during the early season? Cancel your membership and resubscribe in June. That way there would be accountability and would cut the bait-and-switch tactics that they took up.  

 

Making payments with the season pass payment plan is “subject to availability.”

-Caveat Venditor