Kings Island Removing an Attraction?

[kirbias1]

1 minute ago, fyrfyter said:

 

That’s what I’m definitely starting to think.

 

They just repaired a lot of footers on Vortex and got a new sign. Plus, it's one of the last great Arrow loopers left standing and a classic. Doubt it.

[fyrfyter]

They just repaired a lot of footers on Vortex and got a new sign. Plus, it's one of the last great Arrow loopers left standing and a classic. Doubt it.

Never say never. If it’s not popular, the point is moot.

[BeastForever]

3 minutes ago, fyrfyter said:

Never say never. If it’s not popular, the point is moot.

Remember now, lines don't necessarily indicate ridership

On 9/19/2018 at 6:06 PM, SonofBaconator said:

These are old numbers that @malem had posted a while ago. If you go by the numbers of 2014, Vortex is the 5th most ride at the park with a ridership of a little over a million- compare that to Firehawk which has nearly half of Vortex's ridership. I wonder if capacity would improve on Firehawk if they shaded the break run and only used one side of the station.

 

[kirbias1]

13 hours ago, fyrfyter said:

 

Never say never. If it’s not popular, the point is moot.

 

Firehawk makes more sense because that is where the alleged 2020 coaster is probably going to go. It leaves that whole area towards DA and back behind Banshee open to go wherever. Just hope they don't use Firehawk's blah station.

[gforce1994]

Couldn’t help but predict the future tombstone:

[standbyme]

10 minutes ago, Codyfryguy said:

It doesn't make much sense to me but what if they got rid if WindSeeker... it's big and fits the air quote pretty well.

I agree, it doesn’t make sense to me either...except for none of my family consider it a must ride when we go...but by the definition I think you might be onto something. Firehawk just doesn’t seem to fit the teaser...but maybe it’s Mustang Sally all over again!

[GigaLover]

I agree it doesn’t make a whole lot of sense but WindSeeker makes the most since of how the words play together... ItsBigItsGone doesn’t really make much sense connecting Vortex or Firehawk to it but it does connect WindSeeker also the air is eerily calm which connects WindSeeker not the other 2.  I could see it happening but not sure.. maybe that opens up a bigger area for higher volume of people to fit back where spongebob/Days of thunder building is for 2020 attraction to maybe start back that way I don’t know 

also the maybe gives you more room for antique autos 

Edited September 22, 2018 by GigaLover

[JubJester]

20 minutes ago, Codyfryguy said:

It doesn't make much sense to me but what if they got rid if WindSeeker... it's big and fits the air quote pretty well
 

That's what I thought at first, but like you said that wouldn't make sense.

[BeastForever]

Ok after thinking through this some more, I am starting to think that this could be WS instead.

Firehawk is not really something that anyone could consider "big" by coaster standards.

And the use of the word "air"....

Wind - air - wind - air - wind - air - wind - air...

Who knows?...we'll just have to wait and find out.

[BuckeyeBond]

I’d be very surprised to see KI remove a Vekoma Flying Dutchman for a  B&M Flyer. To me it makes zero sense to remove a Flyer just to add a Flyer. Although more reliable B&M flyers also have crap capacity.

[Turtlepower]

It's worth noting that there are 11 chairs in the photo, plus one coffin. There are 12 adult coasters in the park, so if one is dying, there's a seat for each of the survivors. The kids (coasters) aren't big enough to attend.

[fyrfyter]

 

Here’s what concerns me about this list. Vortex lost 60k riders per year. Extrapolate that out another 4 years. That puts it down another 240k riders. That puts its annual ridership around 760k. That’s a problem for a large expensive coaster. It’s on par with Firehawk and BLST.

[fyrfyter]

It's worth noting that there are 11 chairs in the photo, plus one coffin. There are 12 adult coasters in the park, so if one is dying, there's a seat for each of the survivors. The kids (coasters) aren't big enough to attend.

I like the way you think!!! Makes sense to me.

[BeastForever]

3 hours ago, fryoj said:

Yeah, with the placement of the antique cars and them taking up half the midway, the DA location for the Giga was compromised and left some complications about where to put the station. This would clear that up quite a bit. 

Of course, this does at least make you have to consider that maybe it's not going to be a giga afterall. Removal of an inverting coaster could lead to the addition of another inverting coaster. I'm still firmly in camp giga, but this would at drop the odds to at least 90-10. 

If this means anything... KI without Firehawk would still have 4 "hanging coasters", so I don't we'd be getting another one...

2 minutes ago, BuckeyeBond said:

I’d be very surprised to see KI remove a Vekoma Flying Dutchman for a  B&M Flyer. To me it makes zero sense to remove a Flyer just to add a Flyer. Although more reliable B&M flyers also have crap capacity.

And from my experiences on Superman: Ultimate Flight at SFGAd, they're not even that reliable!    *for a B&M*...

30 minutes ago, kirbias1 said:

Firehawk makes more sense because that is where the alleged 2020 coaster is probably going to go. It leaves that whole area towards DA and back behind Banshee open to go wherever. Just hope they don't us Firehawk's blah station.

IMO Firehawk is in a location that wouldn't really get in the way of a giga, or at least, I don't think it would. It's a good amount of track condensed into a relatively small footprint.

[kirbias1]

57 minutes ago, BeastForever said:

If this means anything... KI without Firehawk would still have 4 "hanging coasters", so I don't we'd be getting another one...

And from my experiences on Superman: Ultimate Flight at SFGAd, they're not even that reliable!    *for a B&M*...

IMO Firehawk is in a location that wouldn't really get in the way of a giga, or at least, I don't think it would. It's a good amount of track condensed into a relatively small footprint.

I hope FH stays. The 11 chairs tells me it's probably FH, though. Not happy

[gforce1994]

13 minutes ago, kirbias1 said:

I hope FH stays. The 11 chairs tells me it's probably FH, though. Not happy

KI does have 12 flat rides though.

[Kenban]

My gut says Firehawk.  It’s just such a maintenance nightmare, the trains could be sent to Carowinds to keep Nighthawk going for a while longer.  

But I could see it being Vortex, while it is reliable, it is getting old and has not aged well.  It also has a very prominent location which could be well suited to a replacement coaster.

I would be shocked if it was WindSeeker.

[fryoj]

1 hour ago, BeastForever said:

If this means anything... KI without Firehawk would still have 4 "hanging coasters", so I don't we'd be getting another one...

 

Inverting, not Inverted. Coasters that go upside down. A B&M wing, floorless, dive, etc fit this. 

[McSalsa]

I am leaning Firehawk as well, due to maintenance reasons, but will admit Vortex is getting really old and its popularity is dropping bit by bit every year (though I'd still be surprised to see it going before some of the other, less popular Arrow loopers that are still hanging around). WindSeeker could be another option but it doesn't take up much space, though at over 300 feet tall it easily fits the "big" bill.

Though depending on which one does leave, affects what I think will replace it, though TBH for WindSeeker I can't think of anything ATM. We have good evidence the 2020 project is gonna be a B&M thanks to leaked documents. If Firehawk goes, its location is prime for the long-rumored Giga coaster, and they can expand the X-Base area with a gift shop, restaurant, or even the much requested bathrooms. Though Firehawk's spot is VERY open, so pretty much anything B&M makes could technically fit there.

For The Vortex location, it's a little more cramped. A Giga may not fit, you have Racer and WindSeeker (if that sticks around) on 1 side and Diamondback and eventually Mystic Timbers on the other. The spot is large enough for a Dive Coaster, Floorless, or Wing Coaster though. TBH I could see a Dive Coaster working very well in that spot, have it face the Eiffel Tower and Diamondback before the drop and you have a epic view. Though I imagine with almost everyone thinking "GIGA!" everytime, if we got one of those 3 options people would still be miffed. Heck, they'd be miffed if it was a Giga just because it's likely a B&M ("BUT I WANTED A RMC T-REX GIGA!!!").

I feel really bad for VortexBFForever though. From what I have gathered, she loves all 3 of the rides this "hint" probably suggests are getting removed. Also, I am curious why they would tease a ride removal like this, you would think they'd just be straight-up like: "Yo, we are removing (Insert Ride Here) at the end of this season, ride it as much as possible during Haunt 2018 before it goes." And then have a Mean Streak-esque funeral on closing day of Haunt.

[CoastersRZ]

They set up this scene with this sign to do just what is happening on here now.  Creating buzz and talk about the park.  That is what good marketing plans do.  Get people talking about the park, and sparking interest.  They may not want to tell people what ride is leaving just yet, so that people have to guess, and spend more time riding all the rides, and thus spend more time in the park, and in turn spend more money at the park.  (Which judging by the crowds tonight, there were quite a few people spending money at the park).

Also, keep in mind that on the last Cedar Fair conference call, it was mentioned that they will continue to evaluate what rides are becoming costly to maintain and remove them when necessary to save on maintenance costs, especially if a ride is no longer marketable. 

[SonofBaconator]

Send Firehawk to Michigan's Adventure

[BeastForever]

2 hours ago, fyrfyter said:

Here’s what concerns me about this list. Vortex lost 60k riders per year. Extrapolate that out another 4 years. That puts it down another 240k riders. That puts its annual ridership around 760k. That’s a problem for a large expensive coaster. It’s on par with Firehawk and BLST.

Even if it does fall to the number you extrapolated, I don't think the total yearly operating cost of Vortex divided by the number of rides it gives would be high enough to justify its removal...

Vortex is large, but I don't think its operating cost is very expensive.

SFMM will have 20 coasters next year, and as far as I know there's no sign of Viper being removed anytime soon.

EDIT: I just looked up VIPER and it apparently has been closed indefinitely without any reason given by the park...

[bjcolglazier]

No idea what is leaving, but I cannot possibly imagine them removing Vortex without letting everyone know well, well in advance to get many rides in. The younger folks here might not feel that way, but some of us remember the hype before and as it was being built. It was a big freakin' deal, and still stands in one of the most photogenic spots in the park.

[Arrow]

4 minutes ago, BeastForever said:

Even if it does fall to the number you extrapolated, I don't think the total yearly operating cost of Vortex divided by the number of rides it gives would be high enough to justify its removal...

Vortex is large, but I don't think its operating cost is very expensive.

SFMM will have 20 coasters next year, and as far as I know there's no sign of Viper being removed anytime soon.

If anything there's only signs of Vipers staying around even longer with MM taking the time to update the braking system. Also heard Vortex still gets near a million riders if it doesn't actually reach it.

 

Now you don't ever really know for sure but honestly the more I think about it the more I don't think it's Vortex. Didn't Vortex JUST get new wheels, brake parts, and refurbed footers THIS YEAR? It doesn't make much sense for me to remove it after all that. not to mention the oh so wonderful "new" sign

[upstop]

A dive coaster would go pretty well in place of Vortex. It could follow the same lift hill path dive under the midway, loop over the path back into the ravine. 

[bjcolglazier]

12 minutes ago, upstop said:

A dive coaster would go pretty well in place of Vortex. It could follow the same lift hill path dive under the midway, loop over the path back into the ravine. 

I agree with this entirely. But still. I don't think it is happening. Yet.

[upstop]

I’m just pushing what I’d like to see. Wishful thinking in my part...lol. I guess I’m just being opto-pesimistic... 

[GavPenn]

My guess is the removal of eXtreme Skyflyer. They could be using this space for the B&M, if they use the old S.O.B. station. Kind of how millennium force does at the end. Or even a splashdown like Diamondback.

[VortexBFForever]

Realistically, my guess would be Firehawk. It's the most temperamental ride in the park and it's the ride that maintenance hates the most.

Yes, Firehawk is one of my favorite rides, and I love riding (and working) it! At the same time though, I would not be surprised if it was the ride in question.

WindSeeker ran without a hitch when I was working last weekend. Even after its recent hiccups, I would still say it's still the most reliable of its kind in the chain.

Bottom line: As long as it's not Vortex, I'm fine with whatever is going, albeit a little sad if Firehawk is the ride leaving.

[homestar92]

^ Plus, this is purely anecdotal but Firehawk seems to have taken a sharp and fast dive in popularity over the last few years.

I know, I know. Wait times do not equal popularity. However, I remember maybe 5 years ago, Firehawk would consistently fill its line and have hour-plus waits. Nowadays, it seems like half the days I'm at the park, it's sending half-empty trains.

Vortex ridership has probably gone down in the last five years (we did get a new giant loopy coaster in that time, so that's to be expected) however, it doesn't seem to have been affected nearly as much as Firehawk.

Also keep in mind, Firehawk may be a fairly recent addition to KI, but the ride had been around for many years before it ever made it to our park.

Having just ridden Blue Hawk at Six Flags over Georgia last week, I was very impressed by that makeover. Any chance Vortex is being "removed" but actually getting a refurbishment a la Blue Hawk or Rougarou? I think the chances of that are somewhere above zero. Very inexpensive compared to a new ride, but it would undoubtedly boost ridership quite a lot for at least a short time.

All that being said, Vortex is my favorite ride and Firehawk and WindSeeker are my wife's favorite rides. One of us is going to be having a bad time pretty much no matter what, it seems.