Beast cars

[IndyGuy4KI]

26 minutes ago, silver2005 said:

I'd just be happy with new sets of PTC 2 bench trains for both Beast and Racer.  Sure there'd be a slight capacity dip (I would do 7 car trains for both, 4 for Racer and 3 for Beast), but I think they'd track slightly better than the 3 bench trains.  

 Nooo! I would so miss the middle row..

[harveyhaddixfan]

 Nooo! I would so miss the middle row..

Ditto. I only ride in the front or a middle seat.

[SonODiamondback]

I just checked out PTC page they have one bench trains that look pretty cool

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[silver2005]

^I've seen it.  No way does it have the design features that make Flyers more comfortable.  It looks more like a knee jerk design than something they put effort into, and, BTW, no coaster has them yet.  

[MaestroJr]

The Racer needs a repaint before any new trains but The Beast could benefit with the new trains in my opinion or just different seating and lap bar modifications. MaestroJr

[Maddog]

I would never advocate dropping the 3 row cars on The Beast trains.  The middle row of a car is always the smoothest (as you are not over the wheels).  

In fact when I'm taking friends who are new to KI, when we head over to The Beast I always ask "how rough of a ride" they want.  If they want a thrill, we head for the back row!  For those who want a tamer ride, first car second row is where it's at!

If you're going for an all day park marathon, be sure to ride the woodies just like you ride a horse.  Your body will thank you later.  If you sit there like a rag doll you'll get beat up!

[GigaG]

PTC still makes buzz bars (albeit with seatbelts.) Maybe KI should get some of those. The ride opened with buzz bars and no seatbelts; it should be perfectly safe with buzz bars AND seatbelts, and much more comfortable than the current franken-release system that requires you to be stapled with 2 giant clicks unlike ratchet bars at most other parks that have smaller clicks and a higher minimum position.

 

#BuzzBarBeast2019. Because this ride deserves better for its 40th anniversary. Ditch the headrests as well. Physics hasn't changed in 40 years, Knoebels still runs a much more intense (airtime-wise) woodie with buzz bars (WITHOUT BELTS.) Maybe KI should boldly lead the way for parks reverse this trend of butchering the classic wooden experience with ratchet bars and useless, ugly headrests.

[IndyGuy4KI]

Not that I see that happening GigaG, but here is Hoosier Hurricane at Indiana Beach, their 2 Coasters both have Buzz Bar PTC's.

[TombRaiderFTW]

I would love for more wooden coasters to have buzz bars... but, consider:

1. How many NEW wooden coasters are opening with buzz bars, and why is that number what it is?

2. Where are the coasters currently operating with buzz cars located, and why are they where they are?

Answer both, and you'll know why it hasn't happened already.

(I'm not trying to be difficult... As an engineer, I just don't want to put that much design-related info out there with my name on it and then have someone use it as gospel somewhere...)

[silver2005]

Buzz bars on Racer would be amazing. 

[BlondyRidesOn]

I rode the Tornado at Strickers Grove a couple years ago and it still runs with buzz bar PTCs, at least last time I went it did. Really good ride experience, despite the seat divider. Would love to see some on our woodies again.

[Mystic.Timber1]

On 8/21/2017 at 11:34 AM, medford said:

What if they got GCI to come in and both retrack and reprofile parts of the layout along with providing their trains?  What if they mixed in some of the elements of Wicked Timbers or their many other rides into the long, straight stretchs of The Beast, the areas where trains that could articulate better could handle some wider swings and quick (minor) change of directions.

Sacrilegious or Stupendous?

If GCI were to overhaul the ride and make it smooth I feel beast would lose its charm. My opinion is probably unpopular but I think what, let me say, the cherry on top of Beast is its bumpiness it makes it feel like a Beast throwing you around and it makes the ride more intense. 

[Saerenzea]

I think The Beast is perfect the way it is. I just found out about the middle row and I love it even more now. If you change The Beast it won't be The Beast anymore. Maybe retrack it and add some hills to the long straight part but that's it. 

[whengodsaysgo]

I'd be down for new trains, but DO NOT TOUCH THE LAYOUT! 

PS - Non-scale victory: I carry my weight low and have thinner extremities. At the beginning of the season I needed a little push to get the second click.  Now I fit without assistance!  

The Beast and Mysti are neck and neck for my fave coaster at KI.

[IndyGuy4KI]

Congrats on your victory @whengodsaysgo

[whengodsaysgo]

Just now, IndyGuy4KI said:

Congrats on your victory @whengodsaysgo

@IndyGuy4KI Thank you, kind sir.

[TheRickster]

If flight commander had a divider/passenger restraint that acted like a divider, she wouldn't have fell out.

Just saying there are a reason things are the way they are. Sure it doesn't go upside down, but they do not want you to be able to just slide across the entire car or be able to just stand up/fly out because you were sitting dumb.

[GigaG]

^Knoebels' Phoenix, Indiana Beach's woodies, Silverwood's Timber Terror (AFAIK), Hershey's Comet, and more... all have buzz bars and safely operate today. Phoenix doesn't even have seat belts! As for "sliding across the entire car", while Beast always has had seat dividers, back in a day before the bubbble-wrapping of coasters spread like plague, there was a time when it was NORMAL for a coaster to have a bench seat!

 

PTC's new trains come standard with seat dividers, even buzz bar trains (I emailed them out of curiosity once, and while buzz bars are an option as are not having headrests, all trains now come standard with seatbelts and dividers.)

 

One more note - 3 years ago, enthusiasts said that SFMM never would remove the OTSRs from Revolution. And they did. This is comparable. (Although Revolution's were removed mainly to put VR on it more comfortably, or at least I think that was the reason.)

 

And this plan wouldn't change The Beast drastically. In fact, it would make The Beast much more similar to how it was when it opened, and similar to the way that it safely operated for at least 20 years or so (not sure exactly when it got butchered with ratchet bars.)

 

[CoastersRZ]

Keep in mind that standards can change over the years.  I am not stating that The Beast couldn`t safely be run with just buzz bars and no head rests.  But buildings that were build forty years ago to meet building code, might not meet building codes today, especially since ANSI A117 was introduced (ADA).

[GigaG]

^That appears to be an accessibility thing. What does accessibility have to do with buzz bars? I don't see anything about a buzz bar that makes it less accessible than a ratchet bar.

[SonofBaconator]

Personally, the current PTC trains feel extremely narrow. I love how Millennium Flyer trains give you room to stretch your arms and "relax." 

[FoF96"]

A problem I see with buzz bars is an issue that can be regularly seen on rides like Viking Fury.  America's...stature has changed since the time of buzz bars so what happens when a person with a huge gut wants to ride with their 48" kid that weighs 80 pounds.  It leaves the bar so high off of the kid that there can be a genuine safety concern.  On Viking Fury they make kids sit towards the middle of the row, something they can't do on The Beast.

[GigaG]

^Buzz bars lock in a single position. If it doesn't lock flat, you can't ride. A small child is no less safe with someone who barely fits than they are with a person their size.

 

In fact, some newer rides suffer from this worse than a buzz bar would. Pipe Scream at CP has what appear to be automatically lowering individual restraints, but in reality the restraints are linked and stop at the first person they hit. I believe Surf Dog works this way too. Being relatively large myself, I often end up stapled. Painfully. (The automatic lowering doesn't mess around.)

My first ride on Pipe Scream, on its media day, was a different story. We ended up sitting by a lady who was very large, and my restraint was so loose I could have easily stood up and jumped out of the ride vehicle. A 48" tall child could have done so even more easily.

 

With a buzz bar, again, it has one position. If a rider keeps the bar from closing, they can't ride. In fact, most PTC ratchet bars are allowed to ride LOOSER than buzz bars. Beast, however, has the 2-click rule in conjunction with giant clicks.

And it's not like buzz bars are unsafe for children. Phoenix has a height restriction of 42". Without seatbelts. With famous throw-you-off-the-seat airtime. Remember, my concept is for Beast's new trains to be new PTCs with buzz bars, no headrests, but with seatbelts, and dividers. (Seatbelts and dividers are standard on all new PTCs.) PTC still sells this type of train.