2024 Operating Calendar is Posted.

[super7]

Btw.  An ethical business offers refunds (even prorated is ethical).    Keeping people’s money when they don’t get what they expected is NEVER good business in the long run. 

just like 2020. They did not give refunds when they could not provide what was expected.   They carried it over to 2021 and some people may not have been able to attend that year  

 

[BeeastFarmer]

4 hours ago, super7 said:

just like 2020. They did not give refunds when they could not provide what was expected.   They carried it over to 2021 and some people may not have been able to attend that year  

 

I think that is taking it a bit too far. That, unlike the prestige issue, the reduced days and hours issue, and the budget cut issue, was completely out of their control.

They did work with people in individual cases.

I'd venture a conjecture that all these issues we are facing now would not be in the discussion had COVID 19 not been in the equation.

.

[super7]

3 hours ago, BeeastFarmer said:

I think that is taking it a bit too far. That, unlike the prestige issue, the reduced days and hours issue, and the budget cut issue, was completely out of their control.

They did work with people in individual cases.

I'd venture a conjecture that all these issues we are facing now would not be in the discussion had COVID 19 not been in the equation.

.

It was also out of the control of the customers. It wasn’t their fault.
 

I personally was happy with the extended 2021 pass as many people were, but there were people that could not use a pass in 2021 and they deserved a refund if the pass was unused It’s just not high ethics to keep someone’s money without providing a service or good.

[BoddaH1994]

8 hours ago, Tr0y said:

Making payments with the season pass payment plan is “subject to availability.”

-Caveat Venditor 

That was always my point. If terms are subject to change… why not have it both ways? 

[IndyGuy4KI]

This very KICentral thread makes the news in an article by John Matarese.

https://www.wcpo.com/money/consumer/dont-waste-your-money/kings-island-trims-2024-hours-removes-one-week-of-operations

 

[BeeastFarmer]

5 hours ago, super7 said:

It was also out of the control of the customers. It wasn’t their fault.
 

I personally was happy with the extended 2021 pass as many people were, but there were people that could not use a pass in 2021 and they deserved a refund if the pass was unused It’s just not high ethics to keep someone’s money without providing a service or good.

I think you are focused on the outliers. And I have heard of many of those folks getting refunds.  But if you want a refund and still live close to the park, I think it's reasonable to not give one.

If the pass was used at the end of 2019, I think it's reasonable to not offer a refund, even if the person moved away and couldn't use it in 2021.

The reason they are in the shape they are in is directly related to the pandemic. The decisions they have made over this season are related, and very short sighted.  It will harm them in the long term.  But I'd rather have an open park than a park that closed down because of circumstances out of management control. 

What did Dollywood do for season passholders who did not want 2021 free?  If they didn't offer blanket refunds, would they be an unethical company?

Let's say you were the decision maker for Cedar Fair and were tasked with a solution for this problem.  What would you have done, knowing how precariously your company was dangling over the edge of a cliff?

[disco2000]

2 minutes ago, IndyGuy4KI said:

This very KICentral thread makes the news in an article by John Matarese.

https://www.wcpo.com/money/consumer/dont-waste-your-money/kings-island-trims-2024-hours-removes-one-week-of-operations

 

 

Too bad he didn't counter the argument that other parks like Dollywood, are expanding their calendar.

[BoddaH1994]

Hahahahah

Why don’t they just do they way did last year? There was a wait list!

Oh wait.. he was lying… both times.

#ChadGonnaChad

 

[beastfan11]

Hahahaha. The guy’s pulling excuses directly from some posters/posts on this site. Hilarious. 

[Gordon Bombay]

2 hours ago, beastfan11 said:

Hahahaha. The guy’s pulling excuses directly from some posters/posts on this site. Hilarious. 

John Matarese is a silly and would never have anything to "report" if it wasn't for...

1) This website
2) Apple releasing new iPhones (he does the SAME story every year)
3) His target demographic falling for his scare tactics constantly.

[disco2000]

I know they have historical employment data, but if it has been shown they have to cut dates/hours, then maybe it is time to re-think the hiring process.  

Dollywood does very well with the older community as an example.

I know many older people that do PM hours at KI and have seen the schedule and figure they really won't be getting hours until after Memorial day now.

[BoddaH1994]

4 minutes ago, disco2000 said:

I know they have historical employment data, but if it has been shown they have to cut dates/hours, then maybe it is time to re-think the hiring process.  

Dollywood does very well with the older community as an example.

I know many older people that do PM hours at KI and have seen the schedule and figure they really won't be getting hours until after Memorial day now.

If Dollywood had dorms and Kings Island didn’t, they’d use that excuse. Dollywood figured it out. Kings Island devalued the product. 

[BeeastFarmer]

Interesting that he responded after the story was published.  But to be fair, the unknown is how quickly they needed to publish.  Did they ask for comment last week or ten minutes before the story was published?

[Tr0y]

Regardless of the shortening of hours and days of operation. I’ll be getting more than my moneys worth out of the 2024 season pass. A lot of people here can probably say the same.

 

Also to keep things in perspective:

Dollywood Silver pass = $159 waterpark not included.

Busch Gardens Williamsburg Basic 1 park pass = $165 waterpark not included.

Kings Island Gold Pass = $130 Waterpark included.

Holiday World Season Pass = $165 w/ unlimited drinks.

Not to mention BGW’s Basic Pass and Dollywood’s Silver Pass have blackout dates. 
 

[Orion-XL200]

All I can say is lol.

[disco2000]

Has anyone seen the job postings for the 2024 season?  

[Tr0y]

8 hours ago, BoddaH1994 said:

Why don’t they just do they way did last year? There was a wait list!

 

[BoddaH1994]

12 hours ago, Tr0y said:

 

It’s the gift that keeps on giving, Clark. All year long. 

[Klabergian Empire]

I love how KI is just randomly scheduled to be open Sunday, September 8, 2024, from 10-8 without being open the rest of the weekend.

[disco2000]

Just now, Klabergian Empire said:

I love how KI is just randomly scheduled to be open Sunday, September 8, 2024, from 10-8 without being open the rest of the weekend.

To be fair they are open for private event that weekend (at least usually), so it isn't like only one day.  Or we see this day disappear if a company decides to buy out the park.

[super7]

Staffing issues = we won’t pay enough to attract workers. 
 

Back to Dollywood again!  I went on WEEKDAYS in Sept and now there this week on weekdays    Fully staffed. ALL rides open except seasonal water rides and of course Lightning Rod is down.  Huge live entertainment lineup. But get this.  ALL restaurants, food stands and shops are open   All rides fully staffed.   Running trams. 
 

But cost cutting Cedar Fair can’t “find” workers in a huge metro area. 

 

On 11/13/2023 at 7:24 PM, Tr0y said:

Regardless of the shortening of hours and days of operation. I’ll be getting more than my moneys worth out of the 2024 season pass. A lot of people here can probably say the same.

 

Also to keep things in perspective:

Dollywood Silver pass = $159 waterpark not included.

Busch Gardens Williamsburg Basic 1 park pass = $165 waterpark not included.

Kings Island Gold Pass = $130 Waterpark included.

Holiday World Season Pass = $165 w/ unlimited drinks.

Not to mention BGW’s Basic Pass and Dollywood’s Silver Pass have blackout dates. 
 

One gets what one pays for.   That low pass price is one reason the Cedar Fair experience is C class at best. 

 

On 11/13/2023 at 11:47 AM, BeeastFarmer said:

I think you are focused on the outliers. And I have heard of many of those folks getting refunds.  But if you want a refund and still live close to the park, I think it's reasonable to not give one.

If the pass was used at the end of 2019, I think it's reasonable to not offer a refund, even if the person moved away and couldn't use it in 2021.

The reason they are in the shape they are in is directly related to the pandemic. The decisions they have made over this season are related, and very short sighted.  It will harm them in the long term.  But I'd rather have an open park than a park that closed down because of circumstances out of management control. 

What did Dollywood do for season passholders who did not want 2021 free?  If they didn't offer blanket refunds, would they be an unethical company?

Let's say you were the decision maker for Cedar Fair and were tasked with a solution for this problem.  What would you have done, knowing how precariously your company was dangling over the edge of a cliff?

Offer passes good for 2020 2021 as they did with the option for refunds or cancellation of payment plans  of unused passes.    People were unemployed then.  They kept their money.    
 

They are in the shape they are in because of a bad business plan then the pandemic hit.  High debt due to over expansion (the Paramount parks, installing 20 plus million coasters etc.   Depending on prepaid revenue (paying todays bills with tomorrows ticket sales)    Thsts  not a business plan that can withstand any hurdle too well. 
 

The build-the-biggest/most coaster race and the cheap season pass route did a lot of damage to the theme park industry stability 

[Bad decision]

Closing at 10pm during summer days is the worst decision the park could have made. The hiring process is very complicated. Make changes to the hiring process and you would have staff. And I’m speaking from experience. In my teenage years I would have interviews with the park even a second interview, get uniforms and etc but when it came time to start I would never get a call back and couldn’t get in touch with anyone I experienced this twice. Then in the recent years I took my sister to the park multiple times for interviews and she experienced the same thing. So, look into the hiring process and make it not so difficult then you will have more staff. Me and my family enjoy going to KI on summer days and staying until midnight after dark is the funniest times. Now I will wait on purchasing season passes.

[Stoan]

Keeping Kings Island separate from the rest of CF Parks since I'm unfamiliar with them. I think it's interesting they are claiming a labor shortage for next year when they haven't begun the process of hiring anyone yet when the forecast is workers looking for jobs has been increasing in the past year.

 

The day cutting I can allow, but what I'd love to see is a few days earmarked as "potentials" for extending the operating season if hiring goes better than expected. The hour cutting doesn't make a ton of sense, I feel late night is the most populated times. I'd like to know what predictive metrics they have to show the hour cuts are going to be worth the risk of scaring away travelers with the chance of it being crowded and now having less time.

[BoddaH1994]

So if the SPX says the calendar is subject to change, wouldn’t it be reasonable to say that the smart thing, for those who haven’t purchased their passes yet, would be to wait until on or just before opening day to make their purchasing decision so they have a better feel of what the product they are purchasing looks like? Some people only make a handful of visits per year. Being pushed out of one or two via the calendar may deem whether the pass a reasonable value for them or not.

[Orion-XL200]

1 hour ago, Stoan said:

Keeping Kings Island separate from the rest of CF Parks since I'm unfamiliar with them. I think it's interesting they are claiming a labor shortage for next year when they haven't begun the process of hiring anyone yet when the forecast is workers looking for jobs has been increasing in the past year.

 

The day cutting I can allow, but what I'd love to see is a few days earmarked as "potentials" for extending the operating season if hiring goes better than expected. The hour cutting doesn't make a ton of sense, I feel late night is the most populated times. I'd like to know what predictive metrics they have to show the hour cuts are going to be worth the risk of scaring away travelers with the chance of it being crowded and now having less time.

Well this year they were “fully staffed” yet they didn’t have full staffing on ride platforms, drink stands/restaurants closed, etc. 

[jcgoble3]

On 11/10/2023 at 5:41 PM, jcgoble3 said:

I was considering buying a couple of Winterfest tickets this year (Mom loves Winterfest), but the likelihood of that is continuing to go downhill.

Not entirely on topic, but an update nonetheless. We took advantage of the pre-Thanksgiving online sale and bought two tickets for $19.99 each and went last Friday. We failed to take into account the cost of parking; we had always used my pass for free parking before and without a pass, we were both shocked at the $30 price for regular parking (Mom described it as "outrageous"). Food prices were higher than I even remembered from last year ($16 to $18 for a meal without drink). Because of that, we went to the Brewhouse and split a single Three Pigs entree since both of us have very small appetites, and I noticed that the pulled pork on the sliders was noticeably drier than what I remember from previous years. Soft drinks, which prices I had ignored for several years with the benefit of the season pass drink plan, were outrageous as well (over $5 for a 20oz drink, and nearly $6 for a 32oz which is all that was offered at the Freestyle stand at the Coney Mall entrance).

Once we realized how much price gouging was going on, we made a point of spending as little as possible at the park once we got in (other than buying stuff from the craft vendors) and likely won't go again unless things turn around under the SIX/FUN merger.

I did get to ride Sol Spin for the first time, and that was fun.

[Tr0y]

26 minutes ago, jcgoble3 said:

Food prices were higher than I even remembered from last year ($16 to $18 for a meal without drink). Because of that, we went to the Brewhouse and split a single Three Pigs entree since both of us have very small appetites, and I noticed that the pulled pork on the sliders was noticeably drier than what I remember from previous years. Soft drinks, which prices I had ignored for several years with the benefit of the season pass drink plan, were outrageous as well (over $5 for a 20oz drink, and nearly $6 for a 32oz which is all that was offered at the Freestyle stand at the Coney Mall entrance).

It could be worse, you could’ve spent $18 then be charged an additional $1.29 for house sauce, or pay $5.29 for Swiss Miss infused hot tap water. Oh want to add whip cream? That’s an additional $1.29.

Those up charges I just told you are free at the other parks in the CF chain.

[jcgoble3]

4 minutes ago, Tr0y said:

pay $5.29 for Swiss Miss infused hot tap water

In past years, we've bought the hot chocolate souvenir mug because Mom would refill it and drink it all night long. This year, we skipped it because Mom was diagnosed with type 2 diabetes a few months ago and couldn't have all of that sugar, and I don't care for hot drinks in general.

[KIJOHNNY]

With the huge rise in the diagnosis of diabetes, offering sugar free options or reduced sugar options, would be items that would sell well.

[super7]

On 12/8/2023 at 10:49 PM, jcgoble3 said:

Not entirely on topic, but an update nonetheless. We took advantage of the pre-Thanksgiving online sale and bought two tickets for $19.99 each and went last Friday. We failed to take into account the cost of parking; we had always used my pass for free parking before and without a pass, we were both shocked at the $30 price for regular parking (Mom described it as "outrageous"). Food prices were higher than I even remembered from last year ($16 to $18 for a meal without drink). Because of that, we went to the Brewhouse and split a single Three Pigs entree since both of us have very small appetites, and I noticed that the pulled pork on the sliders was noticeably drier than what I remember from previous years. Soft drinks, which prices I had ignored for several years with the benefit of the season pass drink plan, were outrageous as well (over $5 for a 20oz drink, and nearly $6 for a 32oz which is all that was offered at the Freestyle stand at the Coney Mall entrance).

Once we realized how much price gouging was going on, we made a point of spending as little as possible at the park once we got in (other than buying stuff from the craft vendors) and likely won't go again unless things turn around under the SIX/FUN merger.

I did get to ride Sol Spin for the first time, and that was fun.

These parks have a horrible pricing structure.  
 

if one buys a season, pass and dining plan with drinks and uses it a lot, it’s cheap entertainment 

But if one goes a single time, it’s ridiculously expensive. I think they gouged the people that go one time to make up for the small profits on all these season passes.

it would be much better just to have decent pricing on everything and not give away the house with these season passes
 

And i’m on a season pass.   I spend as little over that as possible at Cedar Fair Parks, because of the way they treat their customers and their employees. 
 

I don’t think the merger is going to fix anything. Out of the two companies Cedar Fair (as bad as they are) is actually the better one and has nothing to gain from being involved with Six Flags.   Cedar Fair is all about cutting cost now and will probably just continue to degrade the customer experience until it’s like a Six Flags experience.