3 hours ago, DonHelbig said:

I wouldn’t say it would be redundant at Cedar Point. Was Mystic Timbers when Kings Island already had The Beast and The Racer?

To add on what KI Guy said above, Mystic Timbers provides a different experience than The Racer and The Beast. The Racer is the classic out and back racing coaster with floater airtime (PTC was good at this), The Beast is a terrain hugging wooden coaster built like a monster prowling through the forest and designed in house, and Mystic Timbers provides a more snappy ride experience. All three built by different manufacturers.

I don't think the same can be said for two RMC I-Box coasters with similar enough experiences to be compared. People already do that with Diamondback and Orion despite their differences in the ride experience.

Uh huh………………

………………………..

5 hours ago, RollerColt said:

Sorry for being unoriginal? Sometimes I like to come here just to escape my awful life, and often that means just a little taste of some mindless talk and speculation. Rare are the days where I feel hope again, so when something... anything positive about this park... even a mere whisper... I'll cling to it. The speculation part is fun to me. The varying opinions is fun to me...

The entire point of… well, all of this fandom, is escapism. At least in my opinion. Sorry things are tough for you right now. Mean that. You don’t deserve to feel like that way.

And I’m also sorry some on this site (and beyond) feel the need to use their faux-insider knowledge as a way to gate keep actual discussion about the park. Being realistic and knowledgeable is one thing, even if it comes across as harsh. But when you’re shooting fish in a barrel (like all of us here) and still missing, it’s a bad reflection on the fandom when that type of attitude is put out on display.

Appreciate you continuing to share your opinions on the matter. That’s what makes this fun.

I am very surprised to see SIX buy this coaster. It seems Carowinds or Kings Island is the good top tier park for this coaster.

I don't want to rule out a lower tier park for it, for they might get a bigger ROI.

18 minutes ago, IndyGuy4KI said:

I am very surprised to see SIX buy this coaster.

It makes sense given the financial position of SIX. They are unwilling or unable to spend big capex on the large former Cedar Fair parks that were taken care of pre-Covid.

All the big money is going to the legacy Six parks in big markets.

They must realize though that one of their parks could use AF1 especially at fire sale prices.

This is probably the best possible ride for the money out there or they wouldn't be doing it. This is a top 10 coaster in the United States per most enthusiasts.

If we can't get an RMC any other way, then I want it for KI. Maybe that's me being selfish for our park.

I saw a theory earlier today (I think on Facebook) that Six Flags (FUN) purchased it to make sure a smaller chain like Enchanted Parks didn't get it for one of their parks. That isn't what I think happened, but it would make an interesting story. I never expected Herschend to buy it since it's a big thrill coaster, nor did I expect United Parks to buy it since they're currently focusing more on family coasters. I wonder if keeping the name is actually baked into the purchase or if it's just a show of good will.

Carowinds would be a good spot for it if they figured out how to make it fit without ripping out a ton of stuff in the process. Dorney is almost entirely hill and does not have land that is suitable for coasters near Steel Force. Great Adventure could absolutely fit it in if they put it on the Boardwalk and were a little creative with the placement, but they're already getting Bakunawa in 2027. Darien Lake and Frontier City aren't likely to be in the running at all. Cedar Point, Discovery Kingdom, Kings Dominion, Magic Mountain, SFOG, SFOT, and most of the other legacy SF parks already have RMC hybrids. I'd hate for this to be the only way for Kings Island to get a hybrid thrill coaster, especially considering that it seems that's how we got Orion.

There are a lot of people saying some form of "Everyone knew this was coming", "This isn't a real announcement", or "So you had nothing new to announce". To those folks I ask this: you do realize that companies have to announce things whether it's "known" beforehand or not, right? I know it's mostly useless to speak to the general void, but I felt it needed to be said either way.

5 hours ago, Losantiville Mining Co. said:

I saw a theory earlier today (I think on Facebook) that Six Flags (FUN) purchased it to make sure a smaller chain like Enchanted Parks didn't get it for one of their parks. That isn't what I think happened, but it would make an interesting story. I never expected Herschend to buy it since it's a big thrill coaster, nor did I expect United Parks to buy it since they're currently focusing more on family coasters. I wonder if keeping the name is actually baked into the purchase or if it's just a show of good will.

Carowinds would be a good spot for it if they figured out how to make it fit without ripping out a ton of stuff in the process. Dorney is almost entirely hill and does not have land that is suitable for coasters near Steel Force. Great Adventure could absolutely fit it in if they put it on the Boardwalk and were a little creative with the placement, but they're already getting Bakunawa in 2027. Darien Lake and Frontier City aren't likely to be in the running at all. Cedar Point, Discovery Kingdom, Kings Dominion, Magic Mountain, SFOG, SFOT, and most of the other legacy SF parks already have RMC hybrids. I'd hate for this to be the only way for Kings Island to get a hybrid thrill coaster, especially considering that it seems that's how we got Orion.

There are a lot of people saying some form of "Everyone knew this was coming", "This isn't a real announcement", or "So you had nothing new to announce". To those folks I ask this: you do realize that companies have to announce things whether it's "known" beforehand or not, right? I know it's mostly useless to speak to the general void, but I felt it needed to be said either way.

Understood your thoughts but this announcement did not change the amusement park industry. Six Flags bought a coaster.... ok....no kidding

39 minutes ago, mikejenkins1 said:

Understood your thoughts but this announcement did not change the amusement park industry. Six Flags bought a coaster.... ok....no kidding

The announcement didn’t turn heads across the amusement industry and reinforce Six Flags’ position as the home of world-class thrills. But it did give people something positive to talk about with the company.

16 hours ago, KI Guy said:

I've noticed that wood coasters are the exception to the rule for coaster redundancy.

...

I've never been to a park with two RMC I-boxes, two dive coasters, Arrow loopers, mine trains, stand ups, or inverts (from same manufacturer), etc.

This. These types of RMC coasters are a pretty specific type of coaster - a hybrid with extreme elements - which makes it pretty unique, which I agree would be redundant at CP.

It's one thing to have a few varieties of steel coasters (loopers, airtime machines, etc.) or wood coasters (out-and-backs, racers, etc.), it would be quite another to have multiple hybrid coasters from the same manufacturer, with many of the same exact design elements, at the same park. Especially when the more recent installation would be inferior in terms of marketable specs and especially capacity.

16 hours ago, DonHelbig said:

They know where it’s going.

Is this fact or opinion?

26 minutes ago, DispatchMaster said:

Is this fact or opinion?

People are going to think what they want, so you decide.

A lot of what Don says feels like sour grapes anymore. We get it. Everything KI and Six Flags does is bad now. Talk about being a broken record saying the same things over and over again.

20 minutes ago, rexpostal said:

A lot of what Don says feels like sour grapes anymore. We get it. Everything KI and Six Flags does is bad now. Talk about being a broken record saying the same things over and over again.

If you don’t like hearing about no ice on repeat, maybe the park should fix the problem. 🤣

I think there are MUCH MUCH bigger issues in the world right now than lack of ice at an amusement park...just sayin'

54 minutes ago, DonHelbig said:

People are going to think what they want, so you decide.

So it's opinion, gotcha.

I'd be surprised if SF has decided definitively where AF is going. I'm sure the list of candidates is narrowed down to one or two parks, but there's a nonzero amount of surveying, engineering, etc., work that needs to be done before they'll "know" where it's going.

5 minutes ago, DJSkyFoxx said:

I think there are MUCH MUCH bigger issues in the world right now than lack of ice at an amusement park...just sayin'

In "the world"? Sure, obviously. But in that context all of these conversations are meaningless drivel.

But a lack of ice at an amusement park is exactly the kind of "death by a thousand cuts" type of issue that affects guests' experience in a meaningful way. And worse, it's a solvable problem.

12 hours ago, beastfan11 said:

The entire point of… well, all of this fandom, is escapism. At least in my opinion. Sorry things are tough for you right now. Mean that. You don’t deserve to feel like that way.

And I’m also sorry some on this site (and beyond) feel the need to use their faux-insider knowledge as a way to gate keep actual discussion about the park. Being realistic and knowledgeable is one thing, even if it comes across as harsh. But when you’re shooting fish in a barrel (like all of us here) and still missing, it’s a bad reflection on the fandom when that type of attitude is put out on display.

Appreciate you continuing to share your opinions on the matter. That’s what makes this fun.

Thanks beastfan. It's been a rough two years. I lost my dad a year and a half ago to liver cirrhosis... It was a very long and painful process, and I think I'm still dealing with the grief and coming to terms. He was the one who got me into my love for amusement parks and roller coasters.

Been dealing with a lot of financial trouble too lately. Things just keep snowballing, but I'm trying to be strong for my family. This website helps me from completely losing it.

1 minute ago, DispatchMaster said:

So it's opinion, gotcha.

I'd be surprised if SF has decided definitively where AF is going. I'm sure the list of candidates is narrowed down to one or two parks, but there's a nonzero amount of surveying, engineering, etc., work that needs to be done before they'll "know" where it's going.

In "the world"? Sure, obviously. But in that context all of these conversations are meaningless drivel.

But a lack of ice at an amusement park is exactly the kind of "death by a thousand cuts" type of issue that affects guests' experience in a meaningful way. And worse, it's a solvable problem.

Check your privilege man. It isn't "meaningless drivel" in the grand scheme of things. Being able to attend an amusement park let alone be able to discuss them IS a privilege, ice or otherwise.

We could round back that the state of the world in it's current form IS having a mass effect on parks and other industries that lean into entertainment. Entertainment isn't a priority to a lot of folks in these current times. People can complain about ice all they want. Sit down and realize your privilege. You are able to drive to/ride to an amusement park, attend it, partake in it and either enjoy it or be miserable. But you still get to be there. Many folks don't have the ability or opportunity to. And you ever stop and think about some folks not even being able to feel safe going due to who they are? Must be nice to never have to worry about that.

Yes, there are many things that could and should be resolved on a molecular level. However, I focus on the bigger picture that I can even go in the first place.

I am struggling to even comprehend what your complaint is about what I said, which is that all of these discussions - about ice machines, ride installations, season pass pricing, meal plans - are relatively meaningless when viewed in a greater context. I am basically agreeing with and expanding upon your response to Don.

That I can recognize that, while also understanding the importance of attention to detail in the amusement industry, is not evidence of "my privilege" or whatever.

TL;DR: Sir, this is a Wendy's.

Literally nothing to struggle over. Just noting that sometimes park people sound ultra-tone deaf to be able to complain about miniscule stuff when that energy could be used for more important things besides complaining on a forum about ice.

I love this hobby, I love this park. But sometimes I just can't with folks.

Also I'll take a 10-piece spicy nugget and an apple frosty if you're offering.

Unless they do something about the capacity, I would think 900 riders an hour would be a tough add for KI.

34 minutes ago, DJSkyFoxx said:

Literally nothing to struggle over. Just noting that sometimes park people sound ultra-tone deaf to be able to complain about miniscule stuff when that energy could be used for more important things besides complaining on a forum about ice.

I love this hobby, I love this park. But sometimes I just can't with folks.

Also I'll take a 10-piece spicy nugget and an apple frosty if you're offering.

When you pay for something and not getting what you paid for, that’s not minuscule stuff. One or two times out of ice or product? OK. It happens. Every day? That’s the issue. They’ve already got your money so it’s not a priority. It impacts the guest experience and plays into the decision to renew passes. Some here can turn their cheek the other way and pretend the problems don’t exist. For me, if they can’t deliver what I paid for, I stop paying for it.

26 minutes ago, DonHelbig said:

When you pay for something and not getting what you paid for, that’s not minuscule stuff. One or two times out of ice or product? OK. It happens. Every day? That’s the issue. They’ve already got your money so it’s not a priority. It impacts the guest experience and plays into the decision to renew passes. Some here can turn their cheek the other way and pretend the problems don’t exist. For me, if they can’t deliver what I paid for, I stop paying for it.

Yeah, man. We know. You've said it ad nauseam since leaving your position.

3 minutes ago, rexpostal said:

Yeah, man. We know. You've said it ad nauseam since leaving your position.

You neglect to mention all the highly positive things I’ve said, the highly positive stories I’ve written since leaving my position. But that wouldn’t fit your narrative, would it?

Let's all take a step back and a deep breath. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, even if they don't align with yours or seem repetitive. We are all here because we love our park, and some passion may be interpreted differently by the next person.

I think we can all agree the park can do better in certain areas, and we can discuss that further in a separate thread. This is about ArieForce One at KI; any further off-topic posts will be removed, regardless of the member.

Back on topic, assuming KI gets this coaster, I am trying to picture where it would fit best in the park. Area 72 makes sense, or Action Zone by removing Timberwolf and possibly Congo Falls, even though I hate to lose another water ride in the dry park.

If there were modifications made available to ArieForceOne what would you like to see different / changed?

I’d like to see better capacity, possibly different restraints all together for trains. If not maybe the quad down at the end be replaced by more gentler airtime hills. The quad down on this and the bunny hop hills on Steel Vengeance are painful to the thighs.

If they wanted to keep the layout of the ride the same, Action Zone is the best location for ArieForce One.

Is this ride worth removing Congo Falls and TimberWolf for? If not, then it fits in between The Bat and Banshee running out into areas once occupied by Son of Beast.

I’d put Six Flags Over Texas, Carowinds and Six Flags Over Georgia right there with Kings Island as the favorites to get it. And don’t sleep on Cedar Point. They have resort rooms they need to fill. Of all the parks in the chain, Cedar Point is the one park you need to keep adding something new or unlike Kings Island, they don’t come.

Cedar Point is arguably the most poorly-suited park in the chain for this ride. They already have a world class RMC with capacity commensurate with their crowds. And to my knowledge they are not having any trouble whatsoever filling those resort rooms, and even if they were, they have plenty of room to lower lodging prices to get occupancy up. Not to mention they just debuted two new world record coasters in two years.

33 minutes ago, Tr0y said:

I’d like to see better capacity

Well, sure, but that is heck of lot easier/cheaper to say than to actually implement. Altering the post-lift layout is one thing. Adding block zones is another matter entirely.

27 minutes ago, DonHelbig said:

Is this ride worth removing Congo Falls and TimberWolf for?

I think the whole area will be revamped over time. Action Zone hasn't been touched for many years and the attractions are quite old. There's also a lot of dead space over there including TimberWolf and the old Xtreme Skyflyer pad.

TimberWolf is a nothingburger, but I think some guests would miss Congo Falls.

If they plan to also remove Invertigo in the near future, there will be plenty of room for a future family water attraction like the one coming to Carowinds (assuming that is a success). Alternatively they could build a Congo Falls replacement on The Vortex plot or even on the Tomb Raider site.

P.S. Yes, I know I sound like I'm playing Roller Coaster Tycoon here, but I'm just trying to think ahead.

43 minutes ago, DonHelbig said:

Of all the parks in the chain, Cedar Point is the one park you need to keep adding something new or unlike Kings Island, they don’t come.

It really does seem like that's the case. I wonder why that is?

Is it from the competition of the late 90s and early 2000s with Magic Mountain? Or perhaps something not entirely within their control?

They've got location going for them in terms of supporting communities: Toledo to the west, Cleveland to the east, Detroit to the north and Columbus to the south. I'd think that would bring in a lot of returning guests each year, but perhaps not.

15 minutes ago, DispatchMaster said:

Cedar Point is arguably the most poorly-suited park in the chain for this ride. They already have a world class RMC with capacity commensurate with their crowds. And to my knowledge they are not having any trouble whatsoever filling those resort rooms, and even if they were, they have plenty of room to lower lodging prices to get occupancy up. Not to mention they just debuted two new world record coasters in two years.

Well, sure, but that is heck of lot easier/cheaper to say than to actually implement. Altering the post-lift layout is one thing. Adding block zones is another matter entirely.

They current have a world class RMC. They may opt to swap that out for one that significantly reduces the maintenance cost. Laugh if you want but we’re living in a world where they’re looking to cut costs and save money.

They are down in attendance. Fact. Not opinion.